Next Project?

[Xperiment]

Hi Guys,

Not been on in a while what with one thing and another, but thought I would share some early plans for my next project. Get some opinions, ideas and the like.

I brought a Lian-Li PC V300 in silver a few days back and have been playing around with some ideas on sketchup. There was no way I was going to draw in all the tiny holes in the front panel so bear in mind they are not shown on the sketch-ups.

The plan is to create a fully watercooled "average specs" PC to use mainly for downloading and web browsing. So reliability and noise are going to be very important. Of course it will need to look the part too!!

Orange acrylic will feature heavily, along with ice white lighting and plenty of brushed aluminium. Here are a few sketch-ups, all to scale. Surprising really how much you can cram into this case given its size. I am going to use a slim laptop optical drive though so this has helped a lot.

Be good to get your opinions / thoughts and as the ideas progress I will keep adding pics.

Xperiment


http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/CaseFront100208.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/CaseFront2100208.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/WaterCoolingFront2100208.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/WaterCoolingFront100208.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/CaseSide120208.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/CaseSide2120208.jpg

[Xperiment]

Anyone .....

[jdbnsn]

I must have missed this, I think it looks fantastic, by all means build it! If you are just using it for basic operations I think watercooling might be a waste of money, you can get very quiet fans for much less and WC is overkill unless the comp is going to be under heavy load. Anyway, I'm not sure if you were talking about ice, or lightning, but either way you could make some killer fan grills to match your case's theme like this...

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f395/jdbnsn/misc/abstract.jpg

[dfigravity]

at is that little portal looking thing on the side? It looks neat :glasses:
I really like this design though...the first thing that came to mind when I saw it was slick. Orange plexi and brushed aluminium is sexy.

[NightrainSrt4]

at is that little portal looking thing on the side? It looks neat :glasses: .

I believe that is his reservoir. It looks very similar in design to the small Thermaltake M1's reservoir/liquid level.

Very nice design as well. Love the orange!

[jdbnsn]

Just let me know when you are ready for this to move to works in progress, I want to see this built!

[Xperiment]

@ jdbnsn - I do agree the watercooling would be a tad overkill, but when I was looking for decent heatsinks for the cpu,nb,gpu I found that there just wasnt the clearence above the motherboard to fit a good cooler.

The specs I am looking at will be, core2duo(not sure which), 8800GT,2gb ram, 2xraptors, a high end motherboard(to make upgrading possible) So to keep that cool with air would end up being too noisy. Plus watercooling just looks so dam nice lol.

I do like the idea of custom grills, I did buy a scroll saw last week so what better way to test it out.

As for the work log, all I have done so far is strip the case. If its ok I will keep this thread for the ideas/planning and then open a worklog once I get moving on it.


@ dfigravity - Its a Aquacomputer Aquatube Res (http://www.kustompcs.co.uk/acatalog/info_7701.html) just mounted with a 5"1/4 bay bracket (http://www.kustompcs.co.uk/acatalog/info_7703.html)

I was torn between going with red or orange acrylic, so I sent off for some samples and decided on the orange, mainly becasue its not a colour that gets used often.

[The boy 4rm oz]

Oh damn I was gonna make a cube mod :(. Every idea I get you are one step ahead of me lol.

[NightrainSrt4]

The plan is to create a fully watercooled "average specs" PC to use mainly for downloading and web browsing.

Wow. Core 2, 8800gt, all for an "average specs" PC. All I can say is DAMN! Can't wait to see this built. Should be sweet!

[Xperiment]

I say average specs as I think it will be about 6-8 months before I start buying the hardware and we all know how far things will have moved spec's wise in that lenght of time.

[Xperiment]

I have been trying to develop the idea a little further and am starting to get a picture of what I want from this case.

I am leaning towards a kind of 'cartoon-like industrial' theme:

- The cartoon-like being, large blocks of orange and very simple defined lines.
- The industrial being, lots of aluminum, hex bolts and a very OTT watercooling loop.

I have done a couple more sketch-ups to try and come up with some ideas/features that fit this theme. The main focus at the moment being the top panel of the case.

I am not 100% decided on the theme as yet so any input would be much appreciated.

Have a look see what you think?

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/TopPanel180208.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/TopPanel2180208.jpg

The three tubes on the outside of the case would be coming from waterblocks and leading back into the res.

I have one or two concerns about this, wondering if anyone can put my mind at rest or put the brakes on this idea before I spend too much time on it.

A cut away picture of what I'm talking about so you can see what I mean:
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/TopPanel3180208.jpg

My concerns are:

a) would splitting the loop into three tubes after it has been through the blocks cause any flow/pressure problems?

and

b) would having the three inputs to the res on the top cause bubbles that would then be sucked through the loop? (this isn't so much of a problem as I could move things about to have them entering the res from the sides, its just easier from a build point of view to have them going in from the top)

Thanks in advance for any input.

Xperiment

[silverdemon]

I like your idea! orange and alu always look good. The three tubes are nice too. I'm sorry though that I do not have any experience in water cooling. I do however suspect that you will have to keep a close eye on the flow/pressure of the system. Maybe you should go for a slightly larger pump?

anyways, the idea _looks_ good...

[The boy 4rm oz]

Looks bloody fantastic. You soooooooo have to make this.

[Xperiment]

@ silverdemon - Thanks, I would be using a 12V Laing DDC1+ Ultra 18W for the pump, hopefully that will be more than enough to get the water moving. Just worried about having 3 inputs and only one output on the res.

@ The boy 4rm oz - hey buddy, cheers. I am really keen to get on and build this but want to plan everything out first. Hopefully iron out all the kinks before I start building.

[tinker]

wow.
It looks really good.
The water cooling tubes on the top make it look really good.
Very cool idea.

[The boy 4rm oz]

I'm really looking forward to make my own cube mod within the next year or so. I will start a thread when I think the sketches are worthy.

[silverdemon]

Thanks, I would be using a 12V Laing DDC1+ Ultra 18W for the pump, hopefully that will be more than enough to get the water moving. Just worried about having 3 inputs and only one output on the res.

If you think/know that the pump will be powerful enough it should be no problem to go with 3 inputs. remember that the WC-system is closed, so there's a certain volume of liquid in it. That liquid is pumped around. Now when you have one tube it'll flow at a certain speed and with a certain pressure. When you have 3 tube (3x the throughput-area) the liquid will flow slower through it and the pressure will drop. If your pump is good enough this should not be a problem.

bottom line: The amount of liquid going out of the res is equal to the amount of liquid getting into the res. The air bubble thing I think should be no problem, as long as you have the outgoing tube (from the res) under the liquid surface (preferably at the bottom of the res).

Hope that helps...
btw I never did WC'ing, I might be totally wrong...

[Xperiment]

@ Silverdemon - Thanks, that's very helpful. It would make sense that there would be a slower flow and lower pressure through the 3 tubes.



Now my next question is going to be, would having a slower flow across or after the blocks be best? I would assume it would be best to have a fast flow over the blocks, but then again would the water be able to 'take on' more heat if it spent more time on the block??

I have drawn up a couple of different waterloops. I know they are by no means laid out in the best way and would be way overkill for the system they will be cooling. They are 95% for cosmetic value.

Just looking for peoples opinions on which one they think would be the best out of the two.

So here they are, any input would be much appreciated:

a)
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/Layout1.jpg

b)
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/Layout2.jpg

What do you think?

[silverdemon]

I think B would be the best way (I'm no expert...) because when I look at B I think the flow will be equally split into 3 flows at one point, meaning 1/3 the pressure and speed in the tubes there.

In A you split the flow three times. in the CPU-block you split the flow 50/50, then the 50% goes to the GPU-block and split 50/50, meaning 25% goes to reservoir and 25% to the NB-block. That's why I think that situation B is the better one. Keep in mind that due to the difference in friction in the tubes those numbers are not entirely correct. maybe the flow will split 60/40 in the CPU-block or 40/60, I dont know.

probably the best way to find out is trying it...

hope that helps

To the WC-experts on the board: who can help him out?

[Zephik]

I'm no expert on this matter either, but I want to say/think that having multiple input with singular output would create too much pressure within the reservoir? I could be wrong though. But, just in case I'm not, I _think_ this would solve that issue if it exists.

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/4900/pressurewz3.jpg

[Xperiment]

@ Silverdemon - Thanks once again for your help, option b would also give me more scope for modding aswell, given that lots of splitting / connections would be needed and what you say about the different flows through each of the blocks would make sense.
Again thank you for your input. +rep

@ Zephik - I never even thought of using 1/2" tubing between the res, rad and pump. What a great idea, thank you. That should help even out the flow. +rep

[silverdemon]

Yeah, the different size tubes is a great idea. I wouldn't worry about the pressure in the res though. Because the fluid that goes into the res must come from somewhere, and that somewhere is the output of the res, through the whole loop... meaning you will never get a higher pressure in the res.

[jdbnsn]

I think that design looks wonderful. As for the WC loop, I'm not really an expert myself but my thoughts are that you should keep it a circular loop without the splits. Reason being if there is any difference in resistance between the three, the one which is the highest will get little water and could possibly stop flowing altogether. Heat may be a factor also, the hottest block may get too little flow. In order to ensure that they all get adequate flow I think your best best is one continuous loop starting with the coolest component and ending with the hottest before the rad, then the res, and back to the pump.

[Zephik]

I think that design looks wonderful. As for the WC loop, I'm not really an expert myself but my thoughts are that you should keep it a circular loop without the splits. Reason being if there is any difference in resistance between the three, the one which is the highest will get little water and could possibly stop flowing altogether. Heat may be a factor also, the hottest block may get too little flow. In order to ensure that they all get adequate flow I think your best best is one continuous loop starting with the coolest component and ending with the hottest before the rad, then the res, and back to the pump.

Good points, that makes sense in my head too. But I think he may be fine if he gets a good strong pump. It seems to me that if it can push liquid through 1/2 inch tubing then it could push it through multiple 3/8ths inch tubing. That makes sense to me at least...

By the way, I was thinking about it and I would switch the reservoir and radiator around. That seems to make more sense to me, what do you guys think? Would it even matter? It might help lower the temperature maybe about a degree or so or something.

[b4i7]

theres one thing ive thought about with splitting coolant up like that

liquid likes to take the path of least resistence... so wouldnt you have a flow problem?

[silverdemon]

...It seems to me that if it can push liquid through 1/2 inch tubing then it could push it through multiple 3/8ths inch tubing. That makes sense to me at least...

I think that's true. I've calculated the throughput area of the tubes:
1/2" -> .39 square inches
3/8" -> .22 square inches
3*3/8" -> .66 square inches

I think that means that the flow speed will be about 2/3 in the 3/8" tubes compared to the 1/2" tubes.

but you will have to make sure (like jon said) to have about the same amount of friction in all three loops, to get an even flow.
I think you should test this before putting it on a working PC and maybe you should get 3 flow-meters, just to keep an eye on the flow-speeds

@ Zephik
Now that you mention it, you probably want to get rid of the heat before you dump your fluid in the res. I didn't see that yet...

[Xperiment]

First off thankyou everyone for your input.

So it does look like I would have a flow problem if I split the loop. I was worried about this, I knew water would take the path with least resistance but wasnt sure if this applied to a closed loop.

I did however have an idea during one of my many day dreams at work today.

What if I used valves, like these:
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/MiniValve.jpg

Placed one on each of the 3 tubes coming out of the side of the case, as below:
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/Rear220208.jpg

Then arranged the waterloop like this: EDIT: "lol notice how one of the splitters actually cools the loop, doh"
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/Layout3.jpg

(The splitters would look something like this: )
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k265/xperiment_2006/Project%20Unnamed/TubeSplitters220208.jpg

This way I can keep the 3 tubes I want on the outside of the case, without messing with the flow across the blocks.
The valves would really help with the theme of the case, but also would give me the option to close off a couple of the splits if they caused a problem.

No real benifit to the cooling of the build and will more than likley cause more problems than they are worth but visually I think they would do the trick.

But as I see it with the loop arranged this way I would just have a higher preasure in the 3 split tubes and that wouldnt really effect the rest of the loop.

What you guys think, problem solved or have a I gone mad lol.

Sorry for all the pictures but I find it much easier to explain with pictures than words. Hope it makes sense.

[silverdemon]

So, let me picture this. with those valves you try to get the same amount of friction in all three loops? or am I misunderstanding the idea? I think it should probably work, but it'll take some finetuning. One benefit is that you can focus on getting the optimum temps on your rig, opposed to 'same flow in every tube' (the gpu might need more cooling than northbridge)

One other thing you can do, but that's a whole different idea, is using three pumps, just use one pump for every cycle you have. I'll upload an image of what I mean in a sec...

[edit]: picture
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j139/rstakelbeek/3pumps.png

[Zephik]

I'm kind of confused with the shut off valves, what exactly are they for? How do they work with what your trying to use them for?

Sorry about the brain fart. lol

[Xperiment]

Yeah sorry reading my post back I didn't really explain very well.

Lets say I have the loop set out as in the picture with the splitters and the valves. The three valves are in the open position, but one of the three tubes is getting a lot less flow than the others, or isn't flowing at all.

I could part close the valves on the other two tubes to create some resistance, increasing the flow through the other tube.

Also say having the three tubes all flowing was causing problems with flow within the loop, I could just close off one or two of the valves turning the loop back into a 'normal' none split loop.

I hope that makes sense, basically I would give myself the option to adjust the flow through the three split tubes - ideally to get an even flow through each of them.

@ Silverdemon - More than one pump would be nice, trouble is I am very limited on space.