Build me a system...

[Airbozo]

As the title says...

Budget: $2000
Design: Simple. Plain case no bling.
Use: Moderate gamer, mostly mmo's some FSP. Only used for gaming.
Other: Must be as quiet as possible.

Future upgrades may include SLI, but only dual. Not going to be overclocked. No water cooling. Multiple drive setup possible. Want it to be a sleeper system (looks plain on the outside, powerful on the inside).

I am doing this for a friend, but I have to admit that I have not been keeping up with the latest mobo's so I do not know where to start. I will be doing a simple build log.

BTW: OS is going to be Windows XP Pro, but possible upgrade to Windows 7 64 bit.

[gramatton]

From what you said, moderate gaming with mostly playing mmos, no watercooling, sleeper system, you could build that for far less than $2000 dollars. With that much you could get a decent i7 system, with some left over. So is 2k exactly what you want to spend, or just a cap?

[Luke122]

i920, Asus Gene II mobo, OCZ Reaper 6gb Ram, ATI 5870, your choice of hdd's, psu, and case. :D

[Airbozo]

From what you said, moderate gaming with mostly playing mmos, no watercooling, sleeper system, you could build that for far less than $2000 dollars. With that much you could get a decent i7 system, with some left over. So is 2k exactly what you want to spend, or just a cap?

It is the cap right now.

I am trying to find out if he wants a new monitor as well which could eat up a lot of the budget. He THINKS he needs the best gear out there, but I have been trying to show him otherwise, for the games he plays... Maybe he just wants to be able to render images and play WoW at the same time. :rolleyes:

[gramatton]

Quick run through of newegg prices, not looking for deals

ASUS Rampage II Extreme $360
Intel Core i7 920 $280
XFX Radeon HD 5770 $175
mushkin 6GB DDR3 1333 $140
CORSAIR TX Series 950W $180
Ultimate sleeper case
CHIEFTEC Dragon $100
Any decent 22" monitor $250

Total $1485 + your choice of ROMs and HDDs
This was just a quick run down, you might be able to find em cheaper somewhere is.

If he mainly plays WoW, a rig thats 1/4 as powerful would be more than adequate.

Also, if you went socket 775 it would cut down the cost quite abit.
eVGA 790i Ultra SLI $175
intel e8600 $280
and memory would be a whole helluva lot cheaper.

Just my 2 cents.

[Datech]

Antec P183 Black Aluminum / Steel / Plastic ATX Mid Tower Computer Case (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129061) - $145
EVGA E758-A1 3-Way SLI (x16/x16/x8) LGA 1366 Intel X58 ATX Intel Motherboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813188039) -$280
Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115202) -$280
OCZ Gold 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227365) - $130
Patriot Warp PE32GS25SSDR 2.5" 32GB SATA II Internal Solid state disk (SSD) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820220341) -$115
2x Western Digital Caviar Blue WD5000AAKS 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136073) -$114
COOLER MASTER Intel Core i7 compatible V8 RR-UV8-XBU1-GP 120mm Rifle CPU Coole (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103055)r -$60
CORSAIR CMPSU-1000HX 1000W ATX12V 2.2 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Modular Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139007) -$240
2x EVGA 896-P3-1171-AR GeForce GTX 275 Superclocked Edition 896MB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130478)
2x Acer X223Wbd Black 22" 5ms Widescreen LCD Monitor -$300
Microsoft Comfort Curve 2000 B2L-00047 Black 105 Normal Keys 9 Function Keys USB Ergonomic Keyboard and Mouse (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16823109156) -$22


If you want really quiet without watercooling, I would have to say go with one of Thermaltake's new 200mm rigs. I gave the Element G a 5/5 for a reason, and its a crap ton quieter than the 140mm fans in the NZXT Beta Evo I'm about to review. All of the new TT Element series has colorful fans though, and I don't know how not-bling you want.

All that comes out on my Newegg Wish List as $1945.83 plus any other cooling fans and systems you want to use. Of course, it can all be shuffled and downgraded and upgraded for certain allowances. All in all, $2000 is a dream system for any of us, and frankly I wouldn't know what to do with all that power. Hardly anything we do these days requires the power that system, or even my own rig, actually has. Crysis, albeit a two year old benchmark, is flawless on my Q8200 and GTS 250. Vista Ultimate 64 bit with Photoshop, the memory leak that is TBCS chat in FF, my IM client, and various productivity software normally only maxes out at 3GB of RAM used.

Give me another price, and specify anything else and I'll do it again. I love system building.

[NightrainSrt4]

All of these builds look good. i7 or i5, decent graphics, etc. If you go i7 920 and have a Microcenter near by and/or the time you can save ~$80 on it.

[Airbozo]

You guys are a great help!

I will be passing around some much deserved rep after my 3 hour meeting (which I am late for...)

[Oneslowz28]

I just want to throw in a plug for Thermaltakes BigTyp 14 CPU cooler. Its a beast but turned on low it is silent at a feather and cools my CPU very nice. On high its a little noisy but has the power to tame the hottest i7 out there.

[Kayin]

+1 on the above plug.

You could go Phenom II and still run anything out there. I run a 720BE and have 0 issues, and if you want to argue that, I'll post my 20k 3Dmk06 on air cooling. That would leave even MORE cash for fun.

[slaveofconvention]

First problem with all of those suggestions is O/S - Windows XP won't have a bloody clue what to do with 6GB of ram. The O/S can only physically detect 4GB across the system, and that has to INCLUDE things like Video Memory. More realistically, it doesn't scale well after 2GB - by the time you include two cards with the best part of a gig of ram, you'll end up with a system which, while it HAS 6GB is actually utilising about 1.5 so a big rethink is in order. If you're set on XP, go with a 3GB kit of memory if you're going i7 and a single VGA card with 1GB or less of memory. It'll save a boatload of cash for future upgrades and perform just as well.

The problem, frankly, IS the choice of O/S. You really need to be thinking Windows 7 and probably professional - the only real bonus with Ultimate is bitlocker for encryption and the ability to change language easily - neither of which is important for the uses you specified. People are responding with the system they'd like for that money instead of looking at what you want.

Personally, I'd suggest something along the lines of an i7 920 (they're overpriced but you have the budget to spare). A GOOD aftermarket cooler to keep the noise down. A PSU closer to 5-600W is more than you need for a single CPU single VGA system and tend to be more established and quieter in use - a stock 920 on an x58 board with single GTX280, flat out at 100% will use around 260W so ignore anyone suggesting a 1000W PSU - you're just throwing money away. As for the case - if you want stealth looks with good flexibility, go with a Lian-li - they're still the king of the case market and some of the current range look like they'd suit this rig down to the ground. You won't get any more stealth than, for example, a PC-A71F and there's a crapload of space in there - it comes with 2 140mm fans running at the front at 1000rpm and 2 120s running at the rear at 1500rpm which is more than adequate cooling if you don't plan to overclock, and with your requirements, there is absolutely no need to. That'll be utterly silent (well as close as you'll get with air cooling) - pretty much every connection in there from the PSU to the hard disks etc is fitted with rubber grommets to reduce noise and vibration.
When it comes to storage space, get a decent sized SSD - something big enough for the OS and all your applications - you have the budget and it'll be again, utterly silent. For additional storage, try a WD green drive - they run slow, admittedly but have very low power consumption and are very quiet because of the lower spindle speeds, which makes them perfect as secondary storage.

If choose every component carefully, and base the choice on what you want it to do, instead of what the press say is new and cool and ultimate, you'll end up with a system which will absolutely fill all of your needs, be powerful, quiet, cool, subtle, and give you some change at the end.

Example:
LIAN LI PC-A71F Black Aluminum ATX Full Tower (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112244)$240
ASUS P6T SE LGA 1366 Intel X58 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131386) £220
Core i7 920 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115202) $290
6GB Corsair Ram kit (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145222) $130
700W Coolermaster silent PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817171037) $130
Arctic Cooling Heatsink (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186134) $34
Kingston 128GB SSD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820139031) $350
WD 1TB Green 5400rpm (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136317) HDD $85
ATI 5870 Video Card - they're all about the same at the moment with them being so new and around $380

That leaves about $150 I think and that'd cover win7 pro oem if pre-ordered.

That'll totally fill all your requirements - it'll probably be so quiet you'll have to look to see if the power LED has come on and with that graphics card I doubt you'll even consider crossfire if his gaming tends to head towards MMOs etc

[Datech]

SoC is completely right, I simply picked out a system from the price point. Windows XP x64 is useless, and you should definitely use Windows 7 x64 if you want to use 4GB or more.

Like I said, if you give me a couple of more specifications I'll get you a system you can actually use instead of the bleeding edge fapfest that I listed before.

[Luke122]

First problem with all of those suggestions is O/S - Windows XP won't have a bloody clue what to do with 6GB of ram. The O/S can only physically detect 4GB across the system, and that has to INCLUDE things like Video Memory.

I disagree.. 32bit XP is limited to 4gb, but doesnt include video memory. It does however limit to 3.3gb if you have a swap file enabled. (This is my experience with it.. disable the swap file, and it will recognize the entire 4gb of ram).

I'll test this today to confirm... I have access to the parts, so why not? :D

[Airbozo]

I love the back and forth on this.

Here is the situation. The person that this system is intended for wants as much system as his $$ can buy and the $2000 is what he has set aside (he can afford WAY more than that, but he is trying to be reasonable). Even if he is not going to be pushing it to it's limits. I am trying right now to convince him to go Windows 7, but knowing this person I expect him to stay with XP until after the first of the year or until he is sure 7 is stable and able to play the games he likes. ...but, he does not want to have to buy more parts once he does upgrade. I also expect that this system will be given to his wife in a couple of years so he can get another (this system is a replacement for one I built for him almost 3 years ago). Yes he changes vehicles like this too. Sometimes I am surprised he has not upgraded his wife... ;)

So the memory issue is moot since I am going to go with 6gb to be ready for Windows 7. I also expect him NOT to go SLI, I somewhat think he is only considering it because it is cool. Not sure yet.

Right now I am going to send him some case ideas, and the Lian Li is fancy enough, but humble looking for him. There are more and I will send some links to him. I am going to ask him more questions about the final use to see if it is truly a gaming only system or if he is going to use it as a media system.

More info soon.

[slaveofconvention]

I'd strongly suggest you try to talk him into a 3gb kit for the RAM, explaining that there are 6 slots on the motherboard so when he does go to windows 7, it's a simple straightforward upgrade with no parts wasted.

[Kayin]

Take a look at the NZXT Khaos for a nice case. I'm still seriously impressed with some of their other stuff.

[gramatton]

If he is worried about his games playing on Windows 7, he need not be. Even the beta version took every game I threw at it with no problems. And the RC1 version is even more stable than my Vista Ultimate 64bit load. Windows 7 64 bit would definately be the way to go for him, especially if he doesn't want to upgrade a whole lot later.

Yes XP 64bit is crap. I always tell people that are hell bent on getting it that its like the bastard child that Microsoft kicked out of the car on a road trip.

I would also have to disagree about XP 32-bit recognizing 4gb of memory across the system. Although I have never gotten it to recognize more than 3.75gb of my memory, even with swap disabled. If it was recognized across the system that should have read something like 3.5gb with my video card at the time having 512.

I also agree that running a Phenom would cost a lot less, but he did say he didn't want to upgrade very much later, and if he does go i7, he will be set for quite awhile. But others did bring up a good point that I forgot about, get a nice cooler for that i7 if you get it, they run hella hot.

[Datech]

SoC, he said he wouldn't upgrade any individual parts without getting a new system. Get the 6GB of DDR3 on an i7 or i5 board and let the OS sort it out later.

If he wants big and bad without multiple GFX cards, just get a single 295 and call it a day

Airbozo, if you want I'll send you a copy of 7 to put on a temp laptop for him to play with. I guarantee he'll love it if he's the type of guy that likes to brag about his systems and upgrades. Any game that runs fine on Vista will run on 7 as well. M$ cranked up the CYA department for 7, because think of the flak Games for Windows would get if even 25% of todays games didn't run out of the box on 7? So far I have tested WoW, Aion, and Spore and they all run better on 7 than Vista, lol.

[d_stilgar]

If you want a true sleeper you have to go with this case. HEC is more or less unknown, but I've used their cases several times because they are solid. Nothing fancy on the inside or out, but it works and you won't cut your fingers either. On top of that it brings "desktop" back to desktop PC.

$40 Butt kicking sleeper case (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811121011&nm_mc=OTC-Froogle&cm_mmc=OTC-Froogle-_-Cases+(Computer+Cases+-+ATX+Form)-_-Compucase-_-11121011)

If he's got desk space and money to spare, then he shouldn't think twice about this 30" Dell. I'm at 28" and can't go below 24" ever again. 20" is too small! Even at this price he would have $900 for an incredible machine. Computing power per dollar doubles every year. $900 in the right place will make it upgradable a little bit each year for the next 4-5 years easy. That's money better spent. What doesn't usually change in that time is the way you interact with your computer.


Dell's last year model 30" LCD (http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/products/Monitors/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=222-7175)

That's my .02

[Airbozo]

SoC, he said he wouldn't upgrade any individual parts without getting a new system. Get the 6GB of DDR3 on an i7 or i5 board and let the OS sort it out later.

If he wants big and bad without multiple GFX cards, just get a single 295 and call it a day

Airbozo, if you want I'll send you a copy of 7 to put on a temp laptop for him to play with. I guarantee he'll love it if he's the type of guy that likes to brag about his systems and upgrades. Any game that runs fine on Vista will run on 7 as well. M$ cranked up the CYA department for 7, because think of the flak Games for Windows would get if even 25% of todays games didn't run out of the box on 7? So far I have tested WoW, Aion, and Spore and they all run better on 7 than Vista, lol.

Yeah, once he gets a system, he is not going to open it except to show his buddies how cool it looks (this guy is a programmer and not a hardware guy).

Windows 7 disks are not an issue since we are a system builder company. We just got our windows 7 SKU's and we can order it anytime, but I think the license stated we could not ship to a customer until the 22nd. I will check. We have 10 of the Premium and Ultimate versions on order which should be here tomorrow or by Friday at the latest. I may even dual boot this sucker just so he see's how things work with both OS's. I know he has not kept up on the windows front, but is vehemently against vista. Something that happened with his company's attempt to use it for their product. Big Fail.

I have a workstation at home with Windows XP x64 (dual xeon 5160 32gb ram) and it works flawlessly with one exception; I cannot get any drivers for my USB MIDI controller. I am going to upgrade it to Windows 7 Premium x64 in the next week or so (gotta love Technet!).

Thanks guys, keep the suggestions coming!

[x88x]

If you can't ship licenses till the 22nd and he wants it before then, you could install without a license, then apply the license on the 22nd :P

I'd say go with the 920, 6GB DDR3, HD5870, a couple SSDs, and a WD Black for storage.

I'd say show him 7; if he likes the impressive shiny as much as he seems to, he'll love it. I haven't found a game yet that won't play on 7, and I've been running the RC since June (and pushing it pretty hard).

[Xpirate]

Windows Vista and 7 home premium have a memory limit of 16 GB. That's not a real big deal right now, but it could become a problem when RAM becomes cheap enough for anyone to score 24 GB.

[Zephik]

Main Components:
Case: Silverstone TJ07 (Black (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163060)or Silver (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163057)) - $370/$350
Mobo: Asus Maximus III Formula (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131482) - $250
CPU: Intel Core i7 2.8GHz (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115214) - $290
RAM: G.Skill Trident 4GB DDR3 (2x2GB) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231282) - $110
HDD: WD Caviar Black 1TB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136284) - $95
GPU: XFX Radeon HD 5870 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150443) - $390
PSU : Corsair 750W 80 Plus (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006) - $120

Secondary Components:
CPU Cooler: Arctic Cooling Freezer 7 Pro (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186134) - $34
Optical Drive: LG Black Lightscribe Burner (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136153) - $30
Case Fans: Cooler Master 120mm Case Fans [x4] (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103052) - $16
Keyboard: Logitech G15 Gaming Keyboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16823126034) - $90
Mouse: Logitech G9 Gaming Mouse (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826104079) - $79
Monitor: Samsung TOC 22" Widescreen Monitor (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001278) - $250
Speakers: Altec Lansing 15W 2.1 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16836113025) - $30
Cables: I'm sure you have plenty laying around somewhere. :p

Other Options:
HDD: WD RE3 1TB in RAID (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136313&Tpk=1TB%20RE3) - $170
Case: Cooler Master Stacker 830 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119122) - $200

Notes:
Do not use WD Caviar Black in RAID! Read the user reviews, people keep running into issues in RAID with these drives. If planning on RAID, use RE3. (listed above under "Other Options")

I chose the XFX brand Graphics Card because for $10 more, you get lifetime limited warranty whereas the others are like 3 years. Figured it was worth the extra $10. That and it has good reviews.

The speakers are average, but as far as average goes, they're affordable and professional looking.

[Datech]

Windows Vista and 7 home premium have a memory limit of 16 GB. That's not a real big deal right now, but it could become a problem when RAM becomes cheap enough for anyone to score 24 GB.

I know I will look back and laugh at this statement, but what in gods name are we going to need 24GB of RAM for?

[x88x]

Windows Vista and 7 home premium have a memory limit of 16 GB. That's not a real big deal right now, but it could become a problem when RAM becomes cheap enough for anyone to score 24 GB.

Sorry, how is this an issue here? It's not like he's gonna give the guy something else.



I know I will look back and laugh at this statement, but what in gods name are we going to need 24GB of RAM for?

Actually, I have a system at work with 32GB :D

In all seriousness though, there's no reason to have that much in a regular desktop system. The only things that'll actually use that much RAM are virtualization, massive databases, CAD/CAM, ...that's all I've got.

[Xpirate]

I know I will look back and laugh at this statement, but what in gods name are we going to need 24GB of RAM for?

We don't really "need" 12 logical processing cores either, but the core i9 processor will have 6 cores with hyper threading. Motherboards are produced now that can hold 24GB of DDR3. 5 years ago I bought a motherboard that could only hold 3GB. Now 4GB is pretty much standard issue for most PCs.


I chose the XFX brand Graphics

I agree XFX is quality.

[Datech]

Bill Gates once said, "Who will ever need more than 64KB of RAM?" or something to that effect...

[Zephik]

I want at least 32TB of RAM in my system. So there! :D

I didn't really finish my list. I was actually going to refine it, as I think its over 2k. I was going to list a bunch of cheaper but still pretty nice options, as you can see I started to do under "Other Options". The list I have right there is purely of the highest quality in my opinion. I didn't get to refine it or provide secondary options because my work called and told me I was supposed to be there 10 minutes ago. WHOOPS! haha

Anyways, hope that helps. It only took me about... 2 hours. lol (one of the better two hours of my life. I love being a nerd sometimes. haha)

Personally, I love that CM Stacker I listed under "Other Options", but I wasn't sure if it was too flashy? So that's where I put it.

[blueonblack]

Ok, I finally got some time. Here are lists - The system I would spend $2000 on (what I would consider the best for that price), and the system I would build for what he plans to use it for.

Best (aka - too much money):
Asus Crosshair III Formula AM3 motherboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131392)

AMD Phenom II x4 955 Black Edition 3.2GHz AM3 CPU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103674)

3 x 2GB Corsair XMS3 DDR3 1333 RAM (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145220)

Asus Radeon HD 5870 1GB video card (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121346)

Corsair 750W single-rail PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006)

Samsung Spinpoint F3 500GB SATA HDD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152181)

Patriot Torqx 64GB SATA SSD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820220390)

LG Blu-Ray burner (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136164)

Lian-Li PC-7B aluminum mid-tower case (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112099)

Hanns-G 28" widescreen LCD monitor (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824254026)

Total before shipping: $1898

More than good enough (aka – better things to spend a thousand dollars on)

ASUS M4A785-M AM3/AM2+/AM2 motherboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131595)

AMD Athlon II x2 250 AM3 CPU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103681)

2 x 2GB Mushkin DDR2 1066 RAM (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820146785)

XFX HF4870 1GB video card (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150436)

Corsair 750W single-rail PSU (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006)

Samsung Spinpoint F3 500GB SATA HDD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152181)

Lite-On 24X CD/DVD burner (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106291)

Cooler Master Centurion mid-tower case (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119106)

Hanns-G 28" widescreen LCD monitor (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824254026)

Total before shipping: $945


I had to get another AMD vote in here. :D

[slaveofconvention]

I would also have to disagree about XP 32-bit recognizing 4gb of memory across the system. Although I have never gotten it to recognize more than 3.75gb of my memory, even with swap disabled. If it was recognized across the system that should have read something like 3.5gb with my video card at the time having 512.

I'm well aware that the "right-click my computer, properties" will show how much memory is physically installed and never takes into account the Video memory - it isn't actually what I was referring to - SP1 for Vista 32bit allowed that view to see 4gb of RAM when before it'd have shown 3.xx - I was referring to how much the system would actually utilise efficiently. The O/S keeps a register of what is where in the RAM - when you go over this amount of RAM the O/S will still see and use it (up to the max of 4gb any 32bit system can utilise but as it isn't properly cached (probably the wrong word) the amount of time the O/S will spend searching the RAM for the data it needs instead of "knowing" exactly where in the RAM that data is cancels out the benefit of having the extra RAM - where extra RAM will usually speed up a system, this searching of the extra RAM can cancel out the speed benefit OF that RAM.


SoC, he said he wouldn't upgrade any individual parts without getting a new system. Get the 6GB of DDR3 on an i7 or i5 board and let the OS sort it out later.

I know he said he wouldn't - that's why I said to try to convince him otherwise - if the guy has enough common sense to ask someone who knows more about computers than he does about the whole build, he might be willing to reconsider this one thing if it's explained properly. The fact is, I'd personally be pushing for Win7 and 6GB from day one, but if he insists on XP the memory searching mentioned above may come into play and make a 6GB system slower than a 3gb one.

I haven't read up as much as I usually have on i5 but I'm currently under the impression that while i7 has the triple channel memory controller for simultaneously accessing 3 sticks at a time, I think the i5 is Dual Channel - still DDR3, but in pairs, not sets of three - i7 - 3x2gb definitely but i5 would probably be either 2 or 4 2gb sticks

[x88x]

I haven't read up as much as I usually have on i5 but I'm currently under the impression that while i7 has the triple channel memory controller for simultaneously accessing 3 sticks at a time, I think the i5 is Dual Channel - still DDR3, but in pairs, not sets of three - i7 - 3x2gb definitely but i5 would probably be either 2 or 4 2gb sticks

This is correct (mostly); the s1366 platform CPUs support triple channel, but the s1156 platform CPUs do not. I think this is just Intel trying to squeeze more money out of the consumer, and I think it's a really dirty thing for them to do, especially since they don't advertise it at all. Apparently they're gonna be developing the platforms in parallel, with s1366 being the 'performance' line, and s1156 being the normal line (kinda like the old P4EE's). Personally, this stunt has put me off Intel products; AMD's offerings offer more than enough performance for today's needs, and usually offer more performance for the money that the similarly priced Intel chip. Granted no AMD CPUs support triple channel RAM communication, but that's because they haven't rolled it out yet, not because they came out with it, made a big deal about it, and then silently dropped it from a new line.

[Xpirate]

Sorry, how is this an issue here? It's not like he's gonna give the guy something else.

You're right. Complaining about Win 7/Vista's RAM limit kind of hijacked the thread. Airbozo said his friend will probably upgrade everything when he's ready for a new machine, so that is a non-issue.

For a quiet case, I bought an Antec Sonata plus. It is nice and quiet with the 120mm fan put on the lowest setting. It's a lot heavier than my old aluminum case.

[Drum Thumper]

I hate coming in late on threads like this--here's a couple of viewpoints from me:


I am trying right now to convince him to go Windows 7, but knowing this person I expect him to stay with XP until after the first of the year or until he is sure 7 is stable and able to play the games he likes. ...but, he does not want to have to buy more parts once he does upgrade.

Completely understandable. I had reservations when I grabbed the first beta. And I was not surprised. But when the second beta came around, I had my socks knocked off--Microsoft finally got it right. Sit your friend down at an XP machine, show him how much of a hassle it is to get drivers loaded for all the added stuff: video cards, printers, some keyboards and mice, etc. And then wipe that system and put one of the 7 betas on there (PM me if you need the ISO, I can snail mail you a copy--you're on your own regarding a key though), and show him how utterly painless Windows has become.

And on a personal note, I never thought I would say that about a Windows release.

As for compatibility issues, 7 has an XP compatibility mode that works much like the 9x compatibility mode that XP has. The only games I have found so far that still gives me ****fits is the
first three Fallout games--1, 2 and the Brotherhood. They work fine in XP though.


I know I will look back and laugh at this statement, but what in gods name are we going to need 24GB of RAM for?

hmmm...I think Mr. Gates put it best:



64k ought to be enough RAM for anybody.

[d_stilgar]

I know I gave my two cents with the monitor recommendation and true old school sleeper beige case, but I want to give a little more of what I would put in it.

My next upgrade is going to be a solid state drive. They are still too expensive for mass storage, but I will be putting my OS and Adobe Master Suite on it as well as a few other programs like that. You will see a huge improvement, especially in boot and load times. Windows will start from power off to ready to go in six seconds. If your friend wants to impress, I say get the 80gig intel drive that's at $240 now.