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View Full Version : Yet another good use of our tax dollars....



SXRguyinMA
04-23-2010, 04:28 PM
Ok so get this. We (us Americans anyways) just paid for this sweet new hypersonic experimental glider that was launcehd today. It will cover 4100 miles in 30 minutes (approx 13,000 MPH). Cool right? Well here's the kicker...after its journey, it's to crasha nd sink into the ocean. WTF is with that? Shouldn't it land and be reused or something?

Article here (http://www.verizon.net/newsroom/portals/newsroom.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=newsroom_portal_page__article&_article=2783581&_ref=articlePage)

NightrainSrt4
04-23-2010, 04:43 PM
I'm having a hard time seeing the point in it. We making super speed Glider bombs?

I wonder if they are at least going to clean it up out of the ocean. Reuse probably isn't a possibility, as hitting water at 13k mph is one hell of an impact, but at least clean the mess up.

blueonblack
04-23-2010, 04:45 PM
Well, NO. How do you expect us Americans to maintain our global reputation as wasteful consumers with thinking like that? That's just crazy talk.

(I'd like to know how much of what ends up at the bottom of the ocean was outsourced from China...)

knowledgegranted
04-23-2010, 06:04 PM
To be quite honest, we are one of the only countries that don't do a TON of experiments like these. Look at Russia, they build about 30-40 experimental jet engines a year (and that's just jet engines).

With the NASA program ending, I see no problem in these experiments. The research tax dollars need to go somewhere in development.

x88x
04-23-2010, 06:11 PM
We making super speed Glider bombs?

From what I can tell...yes. Yes we are... Why? ...umm... :? /shrugs

Here's a much more detailed article about the project:
http://www.globalsecurity.org/space/systems/hcv.htm

Apparently somebody decided we needed to be able to bomb people on the other side of the world really fast, so the obvious solution was to make a glider that would go up into space, accelerate towards the target at a poky Mach 3-4 and then drop mini-plane-bomber-thingies that would then in turn go and bomb things at speeds up to Mach 25. ...yeah, I'm still not really sure why...

Apparently the end goal is that both vehicles will be reusable, but I'm gonna take a wild guess here and say that they probably haven't finished either a) the autopilot and/or b) anything having to to with landing the thing, so their probably just trying to see if the plane burns up on reentry or something.

My question is, if we can spend I'm sure an ungodly amount of money on crap like this, why are budgets all over the place getting cut?

Personally I'm more interested in this thing:
http://gizmodo.com/5522833/air-forces-mysterious-space-plane-launches
Possibly a replacement for the shuttle.

Airbozo
04-23-2010, 06:45 PM
From what I can tell...yes. Yes we are... Why? ...umm... :? /shrugs

...

Apparently somebody decided we needed to be able to bomb people on the other side of the world really fast, so the obvious solution was to make a glider that would go up into space, accelerate towards the target at a poky Mach 3-4 and then drop mini-plane-bomber-thingies that would then in turn go and bomb things at speeds up to Mach 25. ...yeah, I'm still not really sure why...

....

For your answer I will quote another part of the song in my sig (I left out the potentially incendiary religion references);

...Not by a heap or a lump or a smidgeon of foolish rules of ancient date, designed to make you all feel great while you fold, spindle and mutilate those unbelievers from a neighbouring state
To arms, to arms
Hooray! That's great, two legs ain't bad
Unless there's a crate they ship the parts to mama in...

Frank Zappa - Dumb All Over

billygoat333
04-24-2010, 01:26 AM
good ole Frank Zappa. As for this, this is retarded. How bout we dump that money into the stagnating and decrepit public school system?

d_stilgar
04-24-2010, 01:31 PM
I'm thinking a glider like that is one that will have pretty much no heat signature and perhaps very hard to track on radar. So we have a stealth bomber minus the bomber. It's actually a pretty smart idea although I'm not a big fan of war.

nevermind1534
04-24-2010, 02:39 PM
good ole Frank Zappa. As for this, this is retarded. How bout we dump that money into the stagnating and decrepit public school system?

I know that here, the state has been taking billions from the schools over the last few years. Half of the clases that I was going to take next

SXRguyinMA
04-24-2010, 02:51 PM
I'm thinking a glider like that is one that will have pretty much no heat signature and perhaps very hard to track on radar. So we have a stealth bomber minus the bomber. It's actually a pretty smart idea although I'm not a big fan of war.

yea but with something moving through the atmosphere that fast - think about the friction and heat form the air itself. think the space shuttle on re-entry.

also...what about all the marine wildlife that is surely going to die when that thing slams into the ocean? what about them? :facepalm:

slaveofconvention
04-24-2010, 04:43 PM
Fish supper?

dr.walrus
04-25-2010, 05:31 AM
Am I the only person that thinks this sort of scientific research is a good thing?

simon275
04-25-2010, 05:58 AM
At least your government can actually deliver stuff. My state govermnet spent $500million on planning a metro underground train line then canned the plan.

I do agree with dr.walrus it is for science!

dr.walrus
04-25-2010, 06:11 AM
At least your government can actually deliver stuff. My state govermnet spent $500million on planning a metro underground train line then canned the plan.

I do agree with dr.walrus it is for science!

...Wait, NSW, right? I lived down under for a few years. I've used Sydney's railways and they were actually quite good and I didn't see what was so wrong with them that they needed to have that much work done as those massive proposals suggested

crenn
04-25-2010, 06:43 AM
At least your government can actually deliver stuff. My state govermnet spent $500million on planning a metro underground train line then canned the plan.

I do agree with dr.walrus it is for science!

That's bad? THAT'S NOTHING! We spent $1.3 billion on a new ticketing system that only works on 1/3 on what it should. The system is years late too! Even better, they tried to justify not buying a system off the shelf (aka Oyster card) which for me was a huge laugh.

x88x
04-25-2010, 12:55 PM
Am I the only person that thinks this sort of scientific research is a good thing?

I'm all for scientific advancement, and hopefully some useful tech will come out of this, but I just think this research project in particular is more than a little ridiculous. I literally cannot think of any scenario when this would be the best course of action. I thought the Cold War 'our gun is bigger/faster/longer/etc' era was over...

Mushroom720
04-25-2010, 12:56 PM
It's obvious. It's made to fight against the Goauld.
http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/comment/4/2010/04/b4acbcf62c23337e3f75ed1a759cf3cc/original.jpg

dr.walrus
04-25-2010, 06:21 PM
I'm all for scientific advancement, and hopefully some useful tech will come out of this, but I just think this research project in particular is more than a little ridiculous. I literally cannot think of any scenario when this would be the best course of action. I thought the Cold War 'our gun is bigger/faster/longer/etc' era was over...

See, I think of it like this - there are lots of people who consider the LHC a waste of money, but research at CERN produced the WWW as a byproduct, which, even if there's no science other than that that ever come out of the place, it's paid for itself a million times over.

I think cutting edge research has to be done, even if it seems... frivolous... on the surface.

mDust
04-25-2010, 06:29 PM
I couldn't find the article at that link, but I Googled it and read about it elsewhere. It may be crashing into the ocean because it isn't designed to land. It looks like it's going to be a weapons platform that stays in orbit until it's needed. Something like that could bomb any target on this planet just minutes after target acquisition, it's too fast to be shot down, and it's a kinetic bomb when its payload is spent. It's likely to be too expensive for general use, but it could be very useful for rapid target elimination...say terrorists had a nuclear weapon and were going to detonate it. No military is going to be able to respond in 15 minutes to deactivate or destroy it. So the US Air Force deploys a hypersonic 'missile' from god. Everything in the vicinity could be destroyed, including the bomb, with minutes to spare. Unlikely scenario, but it's best to develop tools to save the day before they are needed...

x88x
04-25-2010, 06:41 PM
[...]
This autonomous aircraft would be capable of taking off from a conventional military runway and striking targets 9,000 nautical miles distant in less than two hours. It could carry a 12,000-pound payload consisting of Common Aero Vehicles (CAVs), cruise missiles, small diameter bombs or other munitions.
[...]
The demonstration common aero vehicle system will be able to fly 3,000 nautical miles in approximately 800 seconds and deliver a 1,000-pound penetrator munition. An enhanced version of this demonstration system will be able to fly 9,000 nautical miles in approximately 3,000 seconds. The common aero vehicle and its enhanced version will also be able to "turn" to hit targets up to 800 and 3,000 nautical miles, respectively, off a straight trajectory. For the most part, common aero vehicles require the same technologies as hypersonic cruise vehicles, but also need a more rigorous thermal protection system to prevent their payloads from melting at re-entry speeds as high as Mach 25. By comparison, the hypersonic cruise vehicle will return to its base at speeds of approximately Mach 3-4.

I can't find where it said that the 'CAVs' are going be reusable, but I could have sworn I saw it somewhere...anyways, the big one is definitely going to be reusable.


As of early 2006, the the Falcon Hypersonic Technology Vehicle program planned an initial flight for a less than one-hour flight in September 2007 [later delayed]. The Falcon HTV-1 was to complete its inaugural voyage in the Pacific Ocean. Attaining Mach 19 speed, the glided air vehicle will briefly exit the Earth's atmosphere and reenter flying between 19 and 28 miles above the planet's surface. Demonstrating hypersonic glide technology and setting the stage for HTV-2 represent the primary focus of the lower risk, lower performance initial flight. During the early part of the flight, it acts like a spacecraft. In the middle phase, the HTV reenters the atmosphere like the Space Shuttle, and in the latter stage, it flies like an aircraft.

For the second glided demonstration, scheduled for 2008 or 2009, the Falcon HTV-2 will feature a different structural design, enhanced controllability, and higher risk, performance factors during its high-speed journey. Like its predecessor, the system will reach Mach 22 speed, and then finish its one-hour plus mission in the Pacific Ocean. On the other hand, the third, and final, Falcon HTV, slated for flight in 2009, will be a departure from the previous two demonstrations. The reusable hypersonic glider will lift off from NASA's Wallops Flight Facility, Wallops Island, Va., and then over an hour later, be recovered in the Atlantic Ocean. In addition, the HTV-3, flying at a maximum of Mach 10 speed, will be designed to achieve high aerodynamic efficiency and to validate external heat barrier panels that will be reusable.

BTW, all the linked articles are still online.

slaveofconvention
04-25-2010, 07:09 PM
I got one for ya! Here in the UK there's been a big scandal about expenses claimed by the members of our government. A huge outcry into the amount of taxpayers money being wrongfully or unfairly claimed by Members of Parliament led to a long investigation and audit. In the end, it was determined that the MP's had to repay a total of £1.2 million (about $1.85m US) to the taxpayer.

The investigation/audit itself cost the taxpayer a little over £1.1 million.....

crenn
04-25-2010, 08:53 PM
I think this technology could be used for rapid deployment of supplies to a disaster zone, or be used by Fed Express to do International same day delivery!

x88x
04-25-2010, 09:52 PM
New, from FedEx: 8-hour international delivery, only $500,000! :P

si-skyline
04-26-2010, 12:23 AM
...and your package might be distroyed as it impacts with the water!

(Remember to take out courier insurance)

simon275
04-26-2010, 03:10 AM
...Wait, NSW, right? I lived down under for a few years. I've used Sydney's railways and they were actually quite good and I didn't see what was so wrong with them that they needed to have that much work done as those massive proposals suggested

Yeah NSW. There are some areas of Sydney that have expanded recently and need a train line like North West Sydney.

dr.walrus
04-26-2010, 03:19 PM
Yeah NSW. There are some areas of Sydney that have expanded recently and need a train line like North West Sydney.

Hm, I do seem to remember the bus ride to Sony HQ in North Ryde was actually a total nightmare now you say it...