9am and already irritated.

[BuzzKillington]

Well, I made a quick trip to the grocery store to pick up some odds and ends. I got there at 8:45 and they didn't open until 9.

I did my shopping after trying to find everything in the most unorganized store I've ever shopped in. (my 1st time there... but still.)

Well, I get to the checkout and teenage couple (16-19)were buying a pregnancy test while counting out their change. The guy asked if I was buying my stuff with cash. I said yes. He said I could just give him the money and he'd buy it with his EBT.

I'm not sure if he was trying to be "nice" and save me money by taking advantage of the government program or if he was trying to make money for himself by taking advantage of the government program. Either way, it instantly pissed me the hell off.

I told him no because it's dishonest and taking advantage of the system. I don't know what the intentions were but it really made me realize that the misuse of EBT is most likely waaaaay more of a problem than I already knew if we have people going around spreading the joy.

hvefidnjvkfsduvjfns:mad:

[farlo]

its things like that, that makes me wish they did drug tests to be eligible for public assistance of any type. a percentage of those with assistance like ebt, that are selling, or trading their benefits for money, are likely drug users. i know not all of them are, but any percentage is too much.

[BuzzKillington]

It's like you read my mind.

[mDust]

He was trying to get 'cash back', or effectively using the system to pay for something it doesn't cover...like his next crack rock.

Lazy people that take advantage of 'the system' or other people in general piss me off too. They're poor for a reason...and it's not because 'The Man' is holding them down. It's because they're lazy. A bunch of my friends started doing stuff like that and I sort of started distancing myself from them. I don't support their lack of ambition or their attempt at a free ride. For example, a married couple I know makes a combined annual income of nearly 250k. The guys mother lives with them and is too old to work...she gets food stamps and gives them to the couple! I almost threw up when I found that out. I don't talk to them anymore. That's just disgusting.

I honestly believe that such government programs do more harm than good:
While they may save the people that really need it, there's no real way to determine if someone does in fact need it...so people like that couple are able to use the system just like a single mother of 5.
It teaches people that they don't have to work to get what they want. Say Jimbo works 20 hours a week at his minimum wage job. Government assistance pays for his food and a few other expenses, that way he can still go out and drop the rest of his money at the bar Friday night.
Why try to better your situation when you can scrape by with the bare minimum and then get a little extra from the tax payers so you can live a little more comfortably? I once worked with a guy that dropped a couple of shifts so he qualified for assistance. As he put it: "I can get to work less hours and come out ahead!"
That tax money shouldn't even be collected. Let the people willing to work hard for their money keep more of it...and the people unwilling? They can work more hours or starve. Cruel? Yes. But pain is the best teacher. Consequences are necessary.
Anyone reading this might say 'Hey, this guy's an ass. He probably makes 60-100k a year, it's no wonder he doesn't feel sorry for poor people. He can't even relate to them!' Well, I made diddly-squat last year while working to pay my way through school. I'm not swimming in disposable income. It's true that I can't relate to the stereotypical poor person though, as I'd never let my situation get down to the point where I needed the assistance.

[BuzzKillington]

That reminds me of what a buddy told me when he went to sign up for disability. He broke his back in a motorcycle accident and he said from what he could observe, he was the only one disabled... and the place was packed.

And I agree completely. If you can get away with leeching off of services that are only supposed to be temporary for your entire life without consequence, what's going to get them motivated to move on and get off the government crutch?

They should screen each person more closely, make the usage of the money more strict and to top it off, put a cut off date on their checks. Did I mention it should be mandatory for the user to prove he/she is attempting to find a job? ALLLLSO, it should be illegal to have more and more kids while on these services.

[Airbozo]

...
Anyone reading this might say 'Hey, this guy's an ass. He probably makes 60-100k a year, it's no wonder he doesn't feel sorry for poor people. He can't even relate to them!' Well, I made diddly-squat last year while working to pay my way through school. I'm not swimming in disposable income. It's true that I can't relate to the stereotypical poor person though, as I'd never let my situation get down to the point where I needed the assistance.

Not at all. Truth hurts.

I grew up in a welfare family and know how it perpetuates through generations. My mom found it easier to just stop working and go on welfare. She grew to have the entitlement mentality and spread it onto my siblings. Now all of them are welfare families and their kids too. Totally disgusts me and is most of the reason they never call me or contact me anymore. I am not the type to be quiet about that kind of stuff. Especially with my family.

Now I am not saying that welfare or food stamps shouldn't exist, but the program really needs to be overhauled and those that accept welfare and food stamps should be required to have drug tests and work a minimum set of hours even if it is pushing a broom.

I have been in situations where I needed help, but instead of suckling from the system I went and worked at the car wash and did push a broom for a while (the ONLY white boy at either place too). I did not like the situation I grew up in, and made myself a better person so I never had to live like that. Sometimes it was easy, but most of the time it has been hard work. It is worth it. I am considered the "White Sheep" of the family and only my aunt ever tries to talk with me. I don't really care. I have no use for people that bleed the system dry and then complain because it's not enough.

The military should be able to draft all the freeloaders and put them to work on menial tasks.

[dr.walrus]

I honestly believe that such government programs do more harm than good

Sort of. I'm a firm believer in the welfare state, but you're right, it has massive baggage and foes provide an alternative to working to some low earners.

However, it's totally true that without benefits, some people would totally starve.

My partner is earning a pittance right now, and since I only earn whatever development work I can fit around my course, we've had to make a lot of sacrifices for my studies. She's works in education and she's temping so she isn't paid over the summer, and noone will take her on for 10 weeks of holiday. She has bad knees so factory work is out of the question.

We'll be in receipt of benefits for those ten weeks over summer, and we simply need those benefits to pay rent and bills, which we couldn't otherwise. We have both paid plenty of taxes and I don't have a single qualm about taking a small amount of that money back to make ends meet.

Does this justify the welfare state? No. Does this answer any of its problems? Certainly not. Is it a demonstration that benefit scemes are sometimes neccessary? In our case, I think it is.

[dr.walrus]

I have no use for people that bleed the system dry and then complain because it's not enough.

My mother is one of these people and she's a total waste of space. My brother just qualified as a vet, i'm finishing my degree (went and worked overseas for a few years before working), and my father (divorced from her) just changed trades for the second time in his life and worksso much he's away from home 5 nights a week.

It's pathetic that she doesn't work and the government pays her mortgage and she refuses to work, despite just inheriting her father's house when he died.

But I couldn't bear to watch people's children starve by removing benefits. I've always thought a nationalisation of failing industries could provide a perfect place for these people to work. These companies could run at a significant loss and still save the government money on paying these people benefits.

[Airbozo]

Not sure about where you live, but here in California (and most if not all states) teachers only get paid for the time they work. Which means my wife (a special education teacher) does not get paid over the summer either.

The situation you describe mDust is not an example of a welfare state. It is the reason that programs like these were developed.

It is when people use welfare as a way of life that is the problem. There is no responsibility for any of them to go to work since you and I are paying their way through life.

As to starving, yes I have been there. It made want to stay off of welfare even more. A little hardship in one's life will make you appreciate the concept of working for a living and make you appreciate life and money even more.

[dr.walrus]

Not sure about where you live, but here in California (and most if not all states) teachers only get paid for the time they work. Which means my wife (a special education teacher) does not get paid over the summer either.

In the UK, teachers are paid a salary, but my partner is learning support (in special needs, funnily enough), part time and barely above minimum wage. Some months, we would be better off is she was claiming benefits, but like you, it's against what we stand for.

I will add that I will spend whatever time I can spend working over the summer building websites and working on a chicken farm.

[mDust]

The military should be able to draft all the freeloaders and put them to work on menial tasks.

I've always thought a nationalisation of failing industries could provide a perfect place for these people to work. These companies could run at a significant loss and still save the government money on paying these people benefits.
I like both of these ideas. Perhaps the system could be saved by requiring much stricter application requirements and, if the applicant is able, require the unemployed to be looking for work...verify this, not just take their word for it. (I see people constantly coming into various local businesses to collect business cards for this very purpose. Perhaps businesses could enter applicant names into a national database and if someone's name isn't found in it a minimum number of times, then no benefits.) If no work is found National Guard service or other government work can be made available in order to start/continue getting tax payer money. The key is that work is getting done. No more freeloading... I'll bet hundreds of millions of dollars could be re-appropriated each year to a cause more needy than the system abusers.

[Bopher]

I want to throw something out there but only that because I will give you pages of nonsense ranting about the broken system. I agree with the points made, people who need the system should be on it and people leeching off the system should be shut out. Before we moved we went to the bank and applied for first time home buyer loan for a house. they denied us because I had a little blip on my history. Now I move to NE, I had a manager who was on state assistance, Medical, housing food stamps, etc. The state of NE gave him a house with a mortgage LOWER then my rent on what a lot of people in this area call the nice part of town. But I just barely squeak over the maximum allowed income. Sometimes I feel it would be easier to drop my wife's income and qualify but it will be a cold day you know where before she sits at home and does nothing.

[Liquid_Scope_99]

Not at all. Truth hurts.

I grew up in a welfare family and know how it perpetuates through generations. My mom found it easier to just stop working and go on welfare. She grew to have the entitlement mentality and spread it onto my siblings. Now all of them are welfare families and their kids too. Totally disgusts me and is most of the reason they never call me or contact me anymore. I am not the type to be quiet about that kind of stuff. Especially with my family.

Now I am not saying that welfare or food stamps shouldn't exist, but the program really needs to be overhauled and those that accept welfare and food stamps should be required to have drug tests and work a minimum set of hours even if it is pushing a broom.

I have been in situations where I needed help, but instead of suckling from the system I went and worked at the car wash and did push a broom for a while (the ONLY white boy at either place too). I did not like the situation I grew up in, and made myself a better person so I never had to live like that. Sometimes it was easy, but most of the time it has been hard work. It is worth it. I am considered the "White Sheep" of the family and only my aunt ever tries to talk with me. I don't really care. I have no use for people that bleed the system dry and then complain because it's not enough.

The military should be able to draft all the freeloaders and put them to work on menial tasks.

Man that fits me too a T good post man + rep

[SXRguyinMA]

my brother has sever add and its a little slow but by no means mentally retarded or anything. he lives with his now wife and kid. He had a few odd jobs at the grocery store and such, but he found out that he was getting paid more from SS than he was when he was working! so he said F*** this I'm going to not work and just collect SS because I make more and do less! That kinda stuff pisses me off. My wife and I are struggling, I barely work 40 hrs a week, and she's in between jobs right now, so its a little tough. The catch is that she tried applying for unemployment and they wouldn't give it to her! and we tried to apply for Mass Health (state-assisted healthcare) and were TURNED DOWN because as a married couple (with her not working) we made too much to qualify. WTF is that? I can't afford health ins because my boss only pays 10%, so if I pay the rest we'd have no money for food and her car payment. Things have been better as of late though, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

Still bugs me that my brother can be lazy and suck off the system and get things that people like my wife and I that are actually trying to work and make things work for ourselves can't get a little help

[farlo]

i work a full time job and build and repair computers to make extra money. that being said my son receives an SSI check. he has a duplication of the x chromosome(similar to fragile x syndrome), but it causes a severe delay, and that is the reason he recieves his ssi. he recieves a very small check due to my earnings, but the big thing is he has his health care covered. he goes 5 days a week from 8am-3pm to a place called Kids First, where he recieves speech, physical and occupational therapies. he has a definate need for his benefits as i would have no way of covering is medical expenses without these benefits. but i believe we have come to the consensus that those abusing the system or taking unneeded advantage of it, need to be better scrutinized by those issuing the benefits.