Upgrade time?

[Okele]

So I have permission from the wife to upgrade my PC as long as I upgrade the rest in the house. Limitation however is budget. It isn't low but it isn't exactly high either. I have always owned AMD, from my first PC back in 1997 until now. The only thing that has kept me from Intel is price points. But, with the release of Sandy Bridge, it becomes a little bit more interesting. I have a few choices that I want to run by you guys, and since some other members helped me with my windows 7 upgrade problem the only thing I need to work out is what to get for my PC.

Budget: $500.00(could be negotiated if I buy in pieces as opposed to at once)

Parts I currently have:

Case: RocketFish(Best Buy Lian-Li case)
Motherboard: Asus M4N75TD AM3
CPU: AMD Athlon II X4 630
RAM: 4GB Supertalent something or other. (I have this on the way from the Shell Shocker deal on Newegg the other day: G.Skill RAM (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231315&nm_mc=TEMC-RMA-Approvel&cm_mmc=TEMC-RMA-Approvel-_-Content-_-text-_-)
HDD: 1 250GB, 1 500GB Western Digital and Seagate respectively
GPU: PNY 460GTX, 9800GT(Will be putting this in one of the other PC's)

I have several choices that I can go with. I can stick with AMD, and just upgrade the CPU and get some other stuff to go with it.

AMD Route:

CPU: AMD Phenom II 970 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103894) - 169.00
SSD: OCZ SSD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227550&Tpk=20-227-550) - 119.00
If there are any other suggestions with this setup, please feel free to speak up.

Intel Route A:

CPU: I5 2500K Sandy Bridge (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115072) - 224.00
Motherboard: EVGA SLI P67(not yet released) (http://www.evga.com/products/moreInfo.asp?pn=130-SB-E675-KR&family=Motherboard Family&series=Intel P67 Series Family&sw=5) - 199.00

This route has less room for anything else as opposed to the AMD build. But seems like it will perform far better.

Intel Route B:

CPU: I7 950(1366) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115211) - 269.00
Motherboard: EVGA X58 SLI LE. This one is in their B-Stock listing for 119.00, which is the only reason why I'm looking at this route. No link provided.



Totals:

AMD: $288
Intel Route A: 423.00
Intel Route B: 388.00


Two things should be noted here. The purpose of this upgrade is for two games coming out this year. Star Wars The Old Republic, and Battlefield 3. The current system I have runs WoW and Star Trek Online just fine. But, from everything I am seeing BF3 is going to be fairly heavy on the recommended specs. The other thing that should be noted is system longevity, I may not be able to do a major upgrade again for a few years. While I am interested in the SSD, it is not a must, and it was just something I was looking at. I also realize Bulldozer is being released soon, but I have no idea about pricing or release dates for those chips. So I think I have settled on one of these upgrade paths.

Any help you guys can give me would be appreciated, and will be followed by +rep.

[diluzio91]

For AMD route... why not go with a 955? it has an unlocked multi, a simple bump on the multiplier would save you $40... and i know for a fact that that chip will sail along to 4.0 with a half decent air cooler, heck, even a crummy slightly better than stock one... You can also hit 3.5 on stock voltage.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103808

If you go the 1366 route, go with a microcenter 950, about $200 + tax, but still cheaper than egg's.

Honestly? I wouldnt go the sandy route unless you are, A) planning to get a better CPU later on, B) are wanting to step from DDR2 to DDR3, or C) just wanna have a sandy.
The AMD route would give you more for your $$, and you could probably go up to 8gb of ram, or a better video card too. both of which would give you a better "bang for your buck" speed feel increase than the AMD route.

edit: second GPU, not another, im tired and didnt read the whole post.
Also, for AMD, going from an athlon 630 to a phenom wont show that huge of an increase in proc speed, you might want to budget a 1055t or a 1090t. Especially when
1055t == less than your quad core choice
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103851

and 1090t== slightly more than your quad choice
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103849

And given that bfbc2 uses all the threads on my i7 (eight) you can bet that bf3 will use more cores more effectively too

[Fuganater]

If budget is an issue then I wouldn't even consider a SSD. If your mobo has SATA 6Gb/s then I would peruse that.

Do you have 4GB or 16GB of RAM? Your link if for 4x4GB.

I used to be an AMD fan back in the day but went Intel and will never look back. They just run so much cooler IMO.

I've read great things about the GTX 460. A lot of people talking about they went to that from the XFX GTX 260 Black Edition. (Which I have)

Lastly I think you can find a better Intel mobo that the Route A one. It only supports 16GB of RAM at 1333. For being so expensive it doesn't have that many positive things about it.

[Okele]

For AMD route... why not go with a 955? it has an unlocked multi, a simple bump on the multiplier would save you $40... and i know for a fact that that chip will sail along to 4.0 with a half decent air cooler, heck, even a crummy slightly better than stock one... You can also hit 3.5 on stock voltage.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103808

If you go the 1366 route, go with a microcenter 950, about $200 + tax, but still cheaper than egg's.

Honestly? I wouldnt go the sandy route unless you are, A) planning to get a better CPU later on, B) are wanting to step from DDR2 to DDR3, or C) just wanna have a sandy.
The AMD route would give you more for your $$, and you could probably go up to 8gb of ram, or a better video card too. both of which would give you a better "bang for your buck" speed feel increase than the AMD route.

edit: second GPU, not another, im tired and didnt read the whole post.
Also, for AMD, going from an athlon 630 to a phenom wont show that huge of an increase in proc speed, you might want to budget a 1055t or a 1090t. Especially when
1055t == less than your quad core choice
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103851

and 1090t== slightly more than your quad choice
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103849

And given that bfbc2 uses all the threads on my i7 (eight) you can bet that bf3 will use more cores more effectively too

Ram isnt a concern, I have 16GB on the way, I didn't list it as installed because its not here yet. I looked at the 955, but figured for the extra 40.00 I would get a better proc, but, I suppose for an extra 60 I could say the same thing with the 1090t. Im really just looking for some future proofing, as the wife has decided this is the last time for awhile. As far as Sandy Bridge goes, my only concern is that the upgrade path for it later on might be bottle necked. The 2011 chipset is coming out later this year, but with the success of Sandy Bridge, I know those are going to be expensive. Thanks for the input!

[Okele]

If budget is an issue then I wouldn't even consider a SSD. If your mobo has SATA 6Gb/s then I would peruse that.

Do you have 4GB or 16GB of RAM? Your link if for 4x4GB.

I used to be an AMD fan back in the day but went Intel and will never look back. They just run so much cooler IMO.

I've read great things about the GTX 460. A lot of people talking about they went to that from the XFX GTX 260 Black Edition. (Which I have)

Lastly I think you can find a better Intel mobo that the Route A one. It only supports 16GB of RAM at 1333. For being so expensive it doesn't have that many positive things about it.

I have 16GB in the mail, and it's DDR3. The EVGA actually supports 1600. But I do agree that the positives may not be able to be justified for the price. Any other suggestions? On the 460, I actually like it, and with XFX having issues with Nvidia, it doesn't seem like they will actually support the gpu later on.

[diluzio91]

Hrm, if upgrade path is a concern, you could pick up this guy for a mobo, it takes the ddr3 that you have on the way, and its socket AM3+, so it'll run bulldozer

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157248

And it has sata6 and usb3, all of which will give you a much better upgrade path than the average intel rig, as much as intel has the performance crown, gaming performance is surprisingly limited mainly by the graphics that you have. The 1090t would give you enough performance at stock to last you a few years, and sticking with AM3+ should give you a pretty big edge when its time to sneak another upgrade in. And from what the rumor mill has been saying, the new bulldozer architecture is causing some concern for intel. So despite my current affiliation of nvidia and intel, i would recommend sticking to amd for the moment, just for the future proofing and the availability of better upgrade paths. I'm happy with my intel rig, but when it comes to be upgrade time, i'm gonna have to suck it up and shell out for a new board and a new CPU, while my friend with an am3 socket gx890 just has to get a new CPU

[x88x]

What time frame are you looking at? If I were you, since neither of the games you're upgrading for will be out by then, I would wait until after the Bulldozer chips launch. The latest rumors I've heard are saying early June for that.

Aside from that, I think your GPU will probably be ok if you're sticking with a single monitor, especially with that 9800 dedicated to PhysX. RAM you look like you're good on, whichever route you go.

[Okele]

Hi all,

Ok so this past weekend, my wife sort of forced me to pull the trigger on a purchase. She wanted to go for a drive so I told her about MicroCenter, problem was it was a 200 mile round trip. She told me to show her Microcenters website, and we found some cool CPU/Mobo combo deals. Now in most normal situations a saturday drive of 100 miles should only take about 90 minutes or so. But seeing as how I live in Southern California, 100 miles took 4, thanks to an overturned truck, just my luck right?

Anyway, in going down there, I knew exactly which board I wanted to look at, and that was the P67 Sabertooth by Asus. But alas, strike 1: they were out of stock, strike 2: They were out of stock. He showed me a couple of boards, but the one that caught my eye was the Gigabyte UD4. It supports SLi and Xfire, and is apparently fairly decent for overclocking. Nice thing about MicroCenter is if you buy a cpu there you have to get it from the store, and they cut the price significantly. They also have the bundles which I discussed, and I wound up going with the Gigabyte with an i5-2500K for 339(after MIR, which my wife did the second we got home.) So all in all not a bad purchase.

Now on to two issues I seem to be having.

1. My temps are out of whack, I have reseeded my H50 twice and the temps don't seem to be getting any better. I'm just wondering if the heatsink is too big for the processor area, or if there is something Im just doing wrong. It currently in idle runs between 40-47c, and from everything Ive been reading, on a stock fan it idles in the low 30's. ideas?

2. Gigabyte has this Turbo feature in windows where I can set 3 different speeds. 3.5,3.7, and 4.0. I have tried the feature, it also requires a reboot. Problem is each time I try this program, BIOS shows the new speed, but when I get into windows, CPUZ and CoreTemp both show stock speed. Is this a BIOS issue?

Thanks in advance!

[TheGreatSatan]

You blew $200 on 16GB of RAM! You really need a Micro Center near you. The i7 950 and 2500K are $179

[Okele]

You blew $200 on 16GB of RAM! You really need a Micro Center near you. The i7 950 and 2500K are $179

Actually the RAM I bought was a Shell Shocker deal on Newegg for 139, so I don't look at it as blowing my money. And I drove to Micro Center and bought a 2500K =P it was the drive that killed me lol.

[Fuganater]

I wish I had one near me. The closest one, when I'm home home, aka Pittsburgh, is in Philly.

[x88x]

Actually, the closest one to Pittsburg is in Cleveland. Still ~120 mi though.

[Fuganater]

I hate Ohio....

[Okele]

New opinions:

So my birthday is next week, and my wife asked me what I wanted. I told her a new computer case. She jumped on board because she is tired of seeing the monstrosity that is my Rocketfish case. I have spent the better part of a week researching and looking at different cases. So here are the choices and where I need your guys' expertise. These are not in any particular order, and there are some monetary restrictions. I've been given a budget of $150.00 including shipping and tax. Another thing of note is she is going to call my dad and see if he wants to chip in, so that raises the bar on what I can get, I'm just not sure if he's willing to contribute or if he has something else in mind.

Here's the current list, and feel free to suggest other stuff too:

1. Corsair 600T Special Edition White
2. NZXT Phantom
3. Silverstone RV02-BW
4. Fractal Design Define R3 White or Black
5. Zalman GS-1000 Gaming - Titanium

It's late so I will create some links in the morning, if needed. If you guys can think of any other cases that go along these lines feel free to suggest.

[blueonblack]

I laid my hands on the 600T at CES and I own the Phantom myself. I absolutely love the Phantom and recommend it for any build at all. Just be sure to order the extra fans that it doesn't come with when you get it, as they are proprietary.

Overall an excellent case.

[RogueOpportunist]

To be perfectly honest, unless you are building some supercooled insane overclock 2000$+ system I wouldn't spend a whole lot on the case, the Termaltake V4 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811133179&Tpk=thermaltake%20v4) is 50$ on Newegg, has excellent cooling and doesn't look all that bad... I've owned a lot of cases over the years and for a basic rig I can pretty much guarantee you would not see any real performance difference between the V4 and something like the Phantom.

One thing to consider though is the V4 only comes with 1 120mm chassis fan so you will likely need to buy some extra fans if you need more cooling but you would have to do that with any case pretty much, however on the plus side you can always buy those fans later as the single 120mm positioned as the front intake is enough to cool most systems, after you get the system built you could then add in the 120mm bottom intake, rear exhaust and 2 top exhaust fans.

Just for a comparative example I have my C2D system running in a V4 and before I started folding the thing was running at 4.3ghz on air for gaming, if budget is a concern don't go spending too much on the chassis when you could get something less expensive that performs just as well for your use... and get your wife to spend the extra bux on something else you need. :D

For any system with a 500$ budget I would build around the Thermaltake V4... there's just no reason not to.

[Okele]

I laid my hands on the 600T at CES and I own the Phantom myself. I absolutely love the Phantom and recommend it for any build at all. Just be sure to order the extra fans that it doesn't come with when you get it, as they are proprietary.

Overall an excellent case.

Thanks for the info blue, I think I am crossing the phantom off my list. Only because I have 5 Lian-Li fans that I was planning to use in the new case. If the phantom is proprietary, that will just add cost, which isn't what I was looking to do.

[Okele]

To be perfectly honest, unless you are building some supercooled insane overclock 2000$+ system I wouldn't spend a whole lot on the case, the Termaltake V4 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811133179&Tpk=thermaltake%20v4) is 50$ on Newegg, has excellent cooling and doesn't look all that bad... I've owned a lot of cases over the years and for a basic rig I can pretty much guarantee you would not see any real performance difference between the V4 and something like the Phantom.

One thing to consider though is the V4 only comes with 1 120mm chassis fan so you will likely need to buy some extra fans if you need more cooling but you would have to do that with any case pretty much, however on the plus side you can always buy those fans later as the single 120mm positioned as the front intake is enough to cool most systems, after you get the system built you could then add in the 120mm bottom intake, rear exhaust and 2 top exhaust fans.

Just for a comparative example I have my C2D system running in a V4 and before I started folding the thing was running at 4.3ghz on air for gaming, if budget is a concern don't go spending too much on the chassis when you could get something less expensive that performs just as well for your use... and get your wife to spend the extra bux on something else you need. :D

For any system with a 500$ budget I would build around the Thermaltake V4... there's just no reason not to.

Hi Rogue,

Thank you for the input. I had thought about the V4, but there are a few things driving my thought process on the list I gave. 1. Moddability - My wife and I actually want to do some things to whatever case I get, and the few that I listed(minus the phantom,) provide plenty of options for modding. 2. Asthetics - This case will be on my desk, and part of the reason the raven is on there is for left side placement. Granted, we aren't heavily experienced at modding anything, but the thought of doing it together is what is making the choice so slim, not too mention, we have made the decision to make it a case that is going to last a few years. +Rep

[dr.walrus]

spending lotsa money on a case is primarily for eyecandy, surely?

[Okele]

spending lotsa money on a case is primarily for eyecandy, surely?

Eye Candy and better functionality. I've spent the better part of my life in a position where I HAVE to purchase cheap. Now, we have a little extra money, so I don't want to skimp anymore, but that birdy in the back of my head won't allow me to buy say a TJ-07(not too mention, water cooling financially is just too far out of reach.) If I can get away with a beautiful case for less than 150.00(not including whatever my dad chips in,) and have loads of future options, than that's what I am after.

[Twigsoffury]

Well consider this.

I spent almost 200$ on my current computer case, And i've had it since late 2003.

While most people buy a new cheap case with every build, I've learned its better (in my opinion) to just buy a feature laden computer case, with lots of expansion spaces and a future resistant design.. that also easy on the eyes and something cool to look at every day as well then to repeatedly buy cheaper cases that get replaced.

My buddy just got a white NZXT phantom.

Its long.. its tall... its huge in every way, almost 3" longer then my vento and its probably got another 2" in height. Vento 3600 is a very very wide computer case though at the bottom. (13.3")

But man that NZXT case is sweet, you could fit Godzilla length video cards inside and still have room for fans or lights. everything is laid out nicely, lots of airflow. it's a heavy s.o.b though and the hinges on the door seem like there going to get a little loose after some years of use.

I'd highly recommend the NZXT phantom though. its a sweet sweet ride.

[Twigsoffury]

Well consider this.

I spent almost 200$ on my current computer case, And i've had it since late 2003.

While most people buy a new cheap case with every build, I've learned its better (in my opinion) to just buy a feature laden computer case, with lots of expansion spaces and a future resistant design.. that also easy on the eyes and something cool to look at every day as well then to repeatedly buy cheaper cases that get replaced.

My buddy just got a white NZXT phantom.

Its long.. its tall... its huge in every way, almost 3" longer then my vento and its probably got another 2" in height. Vento 3600 is a very very wide computer case though at the bottom. (13.3")

But man that NZXT case is sweet, you could fit Godzilla length video cards inside and still have room for fans or lights. everything is laid out nicely, lots of airflow. it's a heavy s.o.b though and the hinges on the door seem like there going to get a little loose after some years of use.

I'd highly recommend the NZXT phantom though. its a sweet sweet ride.

[RogueOpportunist]

One thing to consider if you do plan on modding whatever case you get is how much of a pain in the butt it is to try and mod a case you are trying to use, depending on what you are trying to do the system will likely need to be taken a part each time you work on it.

I'm not trying to encourage or discourage anything here, it's just worth mentioning how much more likely you are to procrastinate on your modding when it involves taking your whole system down and possibly leaving it down while you wait for something like paint to dry... If some light modding is on the docket it's a good idea to remind yourself that even seemingly simple mods could put the system inside offline for awhile.

[Okele]

Thanks everyone for your opinions. I am still struggling to make a decision on the case I want to get. My wife has fallen in love with the Corsair Graphite White Edition, but I am leaning towards 3 others. The Raven(I hate the front, but Im not sure I want to ignore the 90degree motherboard setting.) The Fractal Design R3 White. And a new option, which Im heavily leaning towards because of cost, and it has the reverse mobo feature that I am looking for, and that is the Lian-Li A05NB.

At a little over 100.00 the lian-li case has quickly captured my eye. Over at OCN, there is a guy doing a project on this case called Citrus, it's worth a look, and what he's done is rather neat.

[RogueOpportunist]

In regards to the Fractal Design R3 its cooling ability is always going to be lower than any of the other cases you are looking at, the primary "draw" to the R3 is in having a quiet system; however, keep in mind that any case with a fan controller can be just as quiet at roughly the same cooling capacity.

The noise insulating material like the name suggest is an insulator and any steel/aluminum case with low RPM fans is going to be roughly the same as an R3 with higher RPM fans in terms of noise/cooling... At one point I thought I was almost in love with the R3 (for some reason the design just really appealed to me) but after taking a longer look there just isn't much performance to be gained in either the noise or heat areas.

There is a synergy between noise and cooling, when you take steps to insulated against noise you increase the temperatures inside the case, when you take steps to optimize cooling you increase noise... Besides adding weight and requiring higher RPM fans noise insulating a chassis doesn't really do much for you unless you are running a larger raid array and want to dampen the hard drive crunching.

I'm not trying to sway you away from the R3, I just think for most average computer builds pretty much any of those other chassis are going to offer you more in terms of performance.



The Lian-Li looks really nice, I especially like that a manufacturer has FINALLY stopped pulling cold air over the hot hard drives and instead pulls it past the CPU/GPU first... That scores some big bonus points in my opinion.

[Okele]

Ok, I finally pulled the trigger. It was agonizing to make a decision, but I can say that I am at the moment happy with my decision. I went through each case in detail, using reviews, and images alike.

I eliminated the following cases for the following reasons:

1. Phantom - While it is an interesting looking case, I am more interested in straighter lines. Not to mention the fact that having to buy proprietary fans, and not being able to reuse fans I have was a bit of a turn off. It's not to say it's not a cool looking case, it just wasn't in the cards.

2. Zalman GS1000 - I truly liked this case. Some of the machine work on it is some of the nicest I have ever seen. I also really liked the PSU handle, it really made this case unique. I found it on Xoxide, but it wasn't available, and it seems that it is no longer in circulation. I probably would have gotten this one.

3. Silverstone Raven RV02 BW - I love the look of this case, and more importantly the configuration of the motherboard tray. Because I am not inclined to do water cooling until I have a better job to support the many motherboards Im going to fry, air cooling is of high importance. The issue that steered me away from this case was the placement of the HDD tray. With a second GPU on the bottom PCI slot, it literally bumps into the HDD's. This was an issue I just couldn't get over as the HDD's I have are a couple of years old, and I am trying to maintain them as long as possible.

4. Fractal Design Define R3 - I truly love the look of this case. The only reason I steered from this case is because of the deal I found on the case I purchased.

5. Corsair 600T Graphite Special Edition White - I truly liked this case. My wife and daughter loved this case. But all the reviews I read/watched, mentioned the poor performance of the 2 200mm fans on the front and the top of the case. And after looking at temp testing, it performed rather low on the scale. I realize that I could replace those fans, but that's not what I am currently out to do.

Now to my choice. I have been kicking around, and looking around the internetz for well over two weeks. And with the select few, everyone seems to love this case. I am speaking of the Silverstone Raven RV02 - White Limited Edition. I know, I know, I said I didn't choose the Raven RV02-BW, but this is only the same case in look. The HDD limitation killed me on the RV02-BW. But on the white edition, they changed the positioning of the HDD tray to the side, and cable management should be far easier. I live in the desert of California, and the ambient temps here can reach 43 degrees celsius(109F) during the summer. I needed something with good airflow that I could be proud to say I owned.

Another factor that sold me on the case was the fact that it is a limited edition, and "apparently," is only one of 150 in North America. This makes it a possible future collectors item. As far as price goes, while she was dissapointed that I didn't get the corsair case, she did approve the raven. I found a great deal on Amazon for 167.99 with free shipping, and no tax(haven't figured this one out yet.) That's $60.00 off the price at Newegg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163175), after taxes and shipping.

I appreciate all the input that everyone has given me, and if I haven't repped you yet, please let me know and I will do so ASAP!