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tybrenis
06-06-2006, 04:29 PM
National Emo Kid Beat Down Day was today! I managed to beat down 9 kids in my school. I told two of my teachers about it, and they laughed pretty hard. At that moment, I then body slammed some emo kid (he's a total jerk) and he fell down the stairs. At that point, my two teachers laughed even harder (they don't like him) and slapped me on the back, wishing me a good day. Ahh, school these days.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v31/carpejugulum/more/emobeat.jpg

GT40_GearHead
06-06-2006, 04:31 PM
bloody ****, LOL i almost faled from my chair, dude you made my day, bloody emo retards

AKA_RA
06-06-2006, 04:56 PM
im confused, do you think your somehow better than someone by body slamming them and causing them to fall down some stairs? you ever wonder if its people like you that cause kids to come to school with a gun becasue theyre sick of being picked on?

DaveW
06-06-2006, 05:01 PM
im confused, do you think your somehow better than someone by body slamming them and causing them to fall down some stairs? you ever wonder if its people like you that cause kids to come to school with a gun becasue theyre sick of being picked on?

Fair point, though I laughed all the same. I assume tybrenis is joking.

-Dave

GT40_GearHead
06-06-2006, 05:02 PM
that is a good point but could we make an exception for emo, just joking

gamerguy99
06-06-2006, 05:13 PM
i am sick of emos

tybrenis
06-06-2006, 05:13 PM
It's just a big joke. Honestly, I'm a 14 year old on modding forums. Does someone of my sort sound like the bully type that causes people to go on rampages? (I am also not stating that I am a massive nerd either. Not to be big headed but I just won the "Mr. Holicong" dumb contest at my school - Holicong is my school... if you couldn't guess. )

AKA_RA
06-06-2006, 05:17 PM
no. i guess not, your just your average bigot like everyone else who celebrated this "holiday"

tybrenis
06-06-2006, 05:17 PM
no. i guess not, your just your average bigot like everyone else who celebrated this "holiday"

Yep. Basically. :p

I appreciate the labels, especially considering that you don't even know me or what I stand for. You know nothing of my background or any of my friends. I am sure that if you knew me, you would have NEVER said anything of the sort.

AKA_RA
06-06-2006, 05:20 PM
so what do you stand for, besides emo bashing of course.

tybrenis
06-06-2006, 05:23 PM
so what do you stand for, besides emo bashing of course.

Do you honestly want me to list my "Diversity" experiences? Seriously, do you have anything better than killing people's jokes? Thats all it was. A JOKE. I didn't make it up, if that makes you happy. Lets keep this thread mature and on topic, please. If you feel that you need to go on with some sort of flame war, please PM me or something, I don't appreciate this on the public boards and I doubt the mods do either. Save them the trouble please, and just leave this thread.

DaveW
06-06-2006, 05:24 PM
Give it a rest. AKA, you're hypocritical if you think it's ok to slap a label on someone else as long as it's you that's doing it. He's allready said it was a joke. Stop taking it personally.

-Dave

Rankenphile
06-06-2006, 05:35 PM
*sigh*

play nice, kids.

AKA_RA
06-06-2006, 05:36 PM
You don't appreciate this on public boards? I'm really sure the mods aren't going to think that you're "joke" is all that funny. And if they do, then i don't have any reason to stay. I'm sure you'd love that, but I think that the mods would appreciate the fact that I've spoken up for a group that seems to have little representation amongst us modders. And don't go talking about being mature and on topic. The topic was picking on kids that are differant. How is that mature. Even if it was a joke, it wasn't a very tasteful one. And Dave, would you have defended him if he had made a "joke" about beating up African-Americans for their skin color? What if he had used racial slurs? Would you still have his back?

Rankenphile
06-06-2006, 05:41 PM
k, relax, everyone.

it's a joke. probably an inappropriate one, but it's a joke. Getting your undies in a bunch over it isn't going to help.

AKA_RA, you want me to come to your beck and call any time someone posts something you find offensive? Sorry, but it doesn't work that way. I don't even lock or delete everything I find offensive. I try to give you guys as much leeway as I can, try to respect your wishes and let you guys sort things out on your own. If you can't do that, then I have to step in, from time to time, but I'm not the cops, I'm not your enforcer, and asking me to act like that is not appreciated.

Ty, it is kind of a tasteless joke. Inciting violence against someone jsut because of the way they dress is not cool. I know that, you know that, hopefully everybody here knows that. Joking about it walks a fine line, and is probably best left for another forum.

That said, play nice, kids! We're here to have fun, not to get into these petty arguments.

So... how about that local sports team? Eh?

tybrenis
06-06-2006, 05:43 PM
You don't appreciate this on public boards? I'm really sure the mods aren't going to think that you're "joke" is all that funny. And if they do, then i don't have any reason to stay. I'm sure you'd love that, but I think that the mods would appreciate the fact that I've spoken up for a group that seems to have little representation amongst us modders. And don't go talking about being mature and on topic. The topic was picking on kids that are differant. How is that mature. Even if it was a joke, it wasn't a very tasteful one. And Dave, would you have defended him if he had made a "joke" about beating up African-Americans for their skin color? What if he had used racial slurs? Would you still have his back?

Dry your tears, Mrs. Emo. If I had made a racial joke, that would be completely different. Sorry if this bothers you further but I do NOT consider emo kids to be a respectable group. Actually, I wouldn't call them a group at all. I have nothing at all against so called emo music, but I admit that I have quite a bit against self proclaimed emo kids.

Emo music. Emo stands for emotional, am I incorrect? Isn't all music emotional? Isn't that what music is about? Anyone can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Perhaps this is a flame. In fact it is. This is me flaming you:

You proclaiming yourself to be "emo" is stupid and immature. Saying that I don't like emo kids is not discriminative in any kind, as they are not recognized as a group. It is not a way of life and it is not something your born with. It is a fad fashion statement and a sad attempt at a cry for attention. Every "emo" kid I know just does it for one of the following:

1.) The style
2.) So they can tell people that they cut their wrists - so they get attention and people feel sorry for them.

I have no respect for you at all. I laughed hysterically when you compared making fun of emo kids to making fun of a racial group.

tybrenis
06-06-2006, 05:45 PM
Sorry Rank, I have nothing against people for dressing a certain way. I DO have something against people like AKA who claim they are part of a group being discriminated against. Honestly now, can you say **attention cry**?

AKA_RA
06-06-2006, 05:45 PM
Thank you, Rankenphile. Anyways, I'm gonna drop this debate and pick up my dremel.

Rankenphile
06-06-2006, 05:45 PM
edit: Ty, I'm telling you this once. Drop it.

tybrenis
06-06-2006, 05:49 PM
No problem Rank. No disrespect to others, hate to have to get you involved. I know thats not your job - I'm sure you don't look forward to settling immature debates.

Omega
06-06-2006, 07:32 PM
Today was international metal day!

\m/

RAAAAAWRRRRR

*headbangs*

Rankenphile
06-06-2006, 07:35 PM
That's more like it!

Guitar solo!

meedleymeedleymeedleymeedleymeedleymeedleymeedleym eedleymeedleymeedleyMEEEEEE!

Omega
06-06-2006, 07:36 PM
*insert slayer and headbanging here*


man, if a solar eclipse happened, i would run around running "APOCALYPSE! APOCALYPSE! HAIL SATAN! WOOOO!"

Rankenphile
06-06-2006, 07:37 PM
rofl

Omega
06-06-2006, 07:42 PM
Oh, and during english, we moshed to slayer and the teacher let us until the principal showed up

it owned

FyR
06-06-2006, 08:20 PM
i take it emo is an american word for goth? (a person with hair like the pic and listens to depressing music, wears black, eye shadow ect) in the uk we call em goths or greebo's. Over here they tend to all stick together so you'd probably get your ass kicked if you tryed body slamming one of them.

Can you say "skateboard round the back of the head"

nil8
06-06-2006, 08:38 PM
What is it with people and numbers?
Hexakosioihexekontahexaphobia is a fear of the number 666.

Learn the Qabalistic meaning and you might get closer to what the number is supposed to represent.

Omega
06-06-2006, 09:21 PM
i take it emo is an american word for goth? (a person with hair like the pic and listens to depressing music, wears black, eye shadow ect) in the uk we call em goths or greebo's. Over here they tend to all stick together so you'd probably get your ass kicked if you tryed body slamming one of them.

Can you say "skateboard round the back of the head"


An emo is basically a goth, yeah.

guns.

that's all i have to say.

Cevinzol
06-06-2006, 10:51 PM
Ok now I get it.
After reading through the whole thread I finally discovered what an "Emo" was. I never heard of the term. We just called them angsty grunge posers. Even out of school we have them. every place I've worked we've had what I refer to as a "baby harp seal". The co-dependent coworker who's always concerned or upset about sonmething. You just want to club them to death to put them out of your misery.

Now that I know what it means. its a shame I missed out on all the fun. there are a few ex-co-workers I would have like to push down some stairs.

Slug Toy
06-06-2006, 11:06 PM
speaking of pushing people down stairs, i pushed myself down some stairs at school today. i was actually trying to tackle a friend.... but i missed, or rather they dodged.

today is also a provincial "eat your pants on the go" day, and everyone gets licorice pants to wear over top of their normal pants, and we eat them all day long. its a great activity, laced with diabetes and headaches. it sure helped ease the pain of my geography exam. it makes for great fun too.... people just randomly tearing their own pants off and eating them all over the place. when i fell down the stairs, i just laid there screaming for a minute with my pants in my mouth.... like an agonizing floor-snack.

incidentally, today is also "midget tossing day" or for the politically correct... "vertically challenged person tossing day". luckily im tall, so i got to toss a person at a velcro wall, and whats even better is that the short people have to toss themselves at least once. so once i tossed the short guy, he got up and tossed himself to try to beat my height. plenty of concussions today too. sweet, sweet concussions.

xmastree
06-07-2006, 12:29 AM
i take it emo is an american word for goth?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emo_%28slang%29

GT40_GearHead
06-07-2006, 10:13 AM
now you pissed me off, how can you guys say emo=goth came on... damn go listen to type o negative that aint emo.. bloody hell, and no body can tell me not to hit a emo crap-head, a few days ago a gang of them tried to take my money lucky i had my knife(26cm of sharp steel) I DECLARE OPEN season on emo crap-heads

<arrrghh>

Rankenphile
06-07-2006, 11:57 AM
Gearhead - chill the hell out.

GT40_GearHead
06-07-2006, 12:56 PM
Gearhead - chill the hell out.
ok ok ok ma bad i apologize for the agresive tone, its not the place for it ma bad
btw: rank' pics pics pics me wanna see the singing Darth Wader

nil8
06-07-2006, 05:01 PM
People get worked up over such silly things, like hair and clothing.

Omega
06-07-2006, 08:18 PM
People get worked up over such silly things, like hair and clothing.


QFT.

maximan1
06-07-2006, 08:32 PM
What is it with people and numbers?
Hexakosioihexekontahexaphobia is a fear of the number 666.

Learn the Qabalistic meaning and you might get closer to what the number is supposed to represent.
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!
Don't say that number!!!! It scares me...

Rankenphile
06-07-2006, 10:15 PM
Superstitious fears and numerology are one of those little things that just piss me off and make me wonder about the human race in general. I mean, come on. It's a few digits, and jsut because the date happens to coincide with it means that the big scary man in red pajamas that lives in the lake of fire underneath the ground is going to make baaaad things happen to you because he's a big ol' meanie?

Mmmmmkay.

xmastree
06-07-2006, 11:56 PM
Well I was told that it's not 666, but 6^6^6 and if you were to calculate that and print out the result, the paper would catch fire.

Omega
06-08-2006, 12:01 AM
Well I was told that it's not 666, but 6^6^6 and if you were to calculate that and print out the result, the paper would catch fire.


lets see, 6 to the third? or six to the sixth to the sixth?

nil8
06-08-2006, 12:03 AM
QFT.

What?

I agree with Ranken. Stop believing in deities, it only encourages them.

Slug Toy
06-08-2006, 12:21 AM
i ruined a perfectly good monitor!!!!! i calculated 6 to the power of 6, to the power of 6, and it exploded. might have been the fact that i was hitting it with a hammer, but im willing to bet on supernatural forces.

but seriously, i get a kick out of superstitious people. i like to throw black cats around, and carry ladders with me, and cover myself in mirrors. whenever someone tells me ill have bad luck... i just smile and nod and tell them they just made a mountain.

Omega
06-08-2006, 12:21 AM
What?

I agree with Ranken. Stop believing in deities, it only encourages them.


?

QFT = Quoted For Truth.

d_stilgar
06-08-2006, 12:26 AM
I think labeling and discriminating anyone is pretty small minded. I'm sure every one here could be labeled as something, whether it be fat, drunk, nerd, poser, emo, goth, or whatever.

I've learned that the more you try to talk to people and get to know them the more you realize that we are all pretty similar. Some people are jerks and other people are cool. Everything else pretty much doesn't matter. I'll admit that I wear girls jeans, but I'm neither skater or emo or gay. So what am I? According to the labeling chart I should be one of those things, but I'm not any of them.

I'm not shaking a finger at anyone in particular. I'm just saying that holidays should invite everone to participate and promote good feelings. Let me give a list of holidays and we will decide good and bad.

Hard Rock Day - good
Hitler's B-day - not good
Christmas - good
Talk like a pirate day - good
Kill Obese people day - bad

This isn't that hard.

Omega
06-08-2006, 01:14 AM
How is hitler's birthday not good? it's not like it's "kill obese people" day.


Aaaaanywho, stil, that's why sterotyping is pretty retarded.


And yes, we could all be leabeled geeks here =D

Rankenphile
06-08-2006, 02:08 AM
wait...

did you say that it's okay to celebrate the birthday of one of the most hated genocidal maniacs of our time, simply because it's not "kill fat people" day?

because... um... he did, you know, try to exterminate an entire race of people, because he thought they were lesser beings.

but whatever.


as a side note, many people do celebrate Hitler's birthday, but not because it is his birthday. They celebrate because it happens to fall on 4/20. Another foolish holiday, in my mind.

I celebrate it because it is my sister-in-law's birthday. Hitler be damned.

AKA_RA
06-08-2006, 02:13 AM
for some reason, i knew that nazis would come up sooner or later in this conversation, lol

Omega
06-08-2006, 02:21 AM
wait...

did you say that it's okay to celebrate the birthday of one of the most hated genocidal maniacs of our time, simply because it's not "kill fat people" day?

because... um... he did, you know, try to exterminate an entire race of people, because he thought they were lesser beings.

but whatever.


as a side note, many people do celebrate Hitler's birthday, but not because it is his birthday. They celebrate because it happens to fall on 4/20. Another foolish holiday, in my mind.

I celebrate it because it is my sister-in-law's birthday. Hitler be damned.


Uh, Celebrating hitler's birthday isn't bad. Celebrating another anneversary of the Holocaust is.

=p

Rankenphile
06-08-2006, 02:50 AM
Let's agree to disagree on this one, then.

AKA_RA
06-08-2006, 02:54 AM
Celebrating the aniversary of a tragic event isnt always a bad thing. i mean, maybe celebrate isnt the right word for it. its more like, acknowledging it, and looking back on all the lives lost. i think theres a specific word for what im thinking of, but for some reason i cant think of it. kinda like 9/11. and i know that the lives lost in 9/11 dont even begin to add up to that of the holocaust, but im having a hard time thinking of other examples. forgive me?

Cevinzol
06-08-2006, 03:40 AM
i think theres a specific word for what im thinking of, but for some reason i cant think of it.Commemorate (http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/commemorate)

Sounds like Emo is a by-product of ecstacy.
Love the world when you're high, slit your wrist when you come down.

AKA_RA
06-08-2006, 05:48 AM
Thank you, Cevinzol.

nil8
06-08-2006, 08:04 AM
I've never heard that before Omega. Thanks for the compliment.

Pearl harbo/Dec 6 is another example.
Memorial Day and Veterans Day are basically the same thing, just a generalized date. Look up their foundings and find out which American conflict they're related to.

The thing people forget about hitler is before he went nuts and invaded poland he brought germany out of the worst economic depression they have ever seen.
Then he enacted Mein Kampf. Read it sometime, he describes what he does 15+ years before he does it. It's rather creepy.

GT40_GearHead
06-08-2006, 09:58 AM
i wish i could write english the write way, so i could talk about this.... but... gues i'l just have to watch

Rankenphile
06-08-2006, 12:40 PM
Okay, I see where you were coming from then. There is a big difference between celebrating something and holding a memorial for something. I agree that certain things should never be forgotten, and having a holiday to reflect on such things is a good way to keep things in the public mind. Celebrating, however, is usually a joyous event in celebration, not just rememberance, of an event. Which is why I was so shocked by your original statement.

Sure, Hitler was a strategic and economic genius. He came along at the right time and did manage to pull a country that was severely impoverished back onto it's feet. It's what happened afterward that makes him the monster, though. Sure, he did some good things - he was a vegetarian, a painter, and he loved dogs. He restored a national economy. Good for him. That's super. Gee whiz. None of that stuff, however, comes close to overshadowing the unspeakable horrors that were enacted under his rule and in his name, however, and to forget such things is a great travesty.

Omega
06-08-2006, 03:29 PM
Let's agree to disagree on this one, then.


Works for me.

nil8
06-08-2006, 03:34 PM
Definitely, but a lot of people buy into the facade and forget the people. The reason is because it's a seperation from the monsters. They want them to be subhuman. People don't want to realize the amount of evil they can cause.

Ghandi was racist against Africans. He did great things for the nonviolence movement and for the people of India, but he was still human.

As for the Nazi movement today, pffft. Bunch of clingers. Grow up and join another socialist ideal.

tennysol
06-08-2006, 05:02 PM
I thought Emo was a muppet?:D

Slug Toy
06-08-2006, 05:59 PM
I'm sure every one here could be labeled as something, whether it be fat, drunk, nerd, poser, emo, goth, or whatever.


AWESOME???




People don't want to realize the amount of evil they can cause.

oh i think you're wrong. i think most people are quite aware of their evils, but they just kind of shove that awareness into a corner. i for one embrace my evil capabilities. you never know when a pyro will come in handy.


Grow up and join another socialist ideal.

a TOAST to that... now wheres my flame thrower.

xmastree
06-08-2006, 08:39 PM
I thought Emo was a muppet?:D
No, that's Elmo.

Emo is a stand-up comedian, another Emo is a keyboard god.

And what's beating down anyway? Is that the opposite of beating up?

tybrenis
06-08-2006, 08:52 PM
Beating down is more fun. It sounds more "gang-fighty". I mean, you beat them, and they fall down, thus you beat them DOWNwards. I never really got why people said beat up...

Rankenphile
06-09-2006, 12:24 AM
Beat up? Simple enough to understand.

Observe:

http://www.411images.com/images/games/screenshots2/e32004sfac7.jpg

OvRiDe
06-09-2006, 01:01 AM
Nice example Rank! One of my all time favorites


Pearl harbo/Dec 6 is another example.
Not to nit pick but.. Pearl Harbor day is Dec. 7th.. ;)

Omega
06-09-2006, 02:07 AM
you never know when a pyro will come in handy.



I know when one will come in handy.


A metal concert.

DaveW
06-09-2006, 07:08 AM
Gee-whilikers, mom! Look at the speed of that runaway thread! Wowee!

-Dave

tennysol
06-09-2006, 11:07 AM
Some of the famous "-Mo's"

http://www.lotechdesigns.com/host/images/5308Emo.jpg Emo

http://www.lotechdesigns.com/host/images/4400Domo.jpg Domo

http://www.lotechdesigns.com/host/images/4026Elmo.jpg Elmo

http://www.lotechdesigns.com/host/images/2027Nismo.jpg Nismo

http://www.lotechdesigns.com/host/images/6596HeyMoe.jpg HEY MO!

Omega
06-09-2006, 03:31 PM
Nismo Ftw

xmastree
06-09-2006, 08:51 PM
Some of the famous "-Mo's"

http://www.lotechdesigns.com/host/images/5308Emo.jpg EmoThat's not Emo, this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emo_Philips) is.

tybrenis
06-10-2006, 03:15 PM
Lol

GT40_GearHead
06-10-2006, 05:00 PM
ouuuu damn

MrSlacker
06-10-2006, 11:21 PM
You are 14?

No further questions

tybrenis
06-10-2006, 11:26 PM
May I ask who that question is directed at, my kind sir?

MrSlacker
06-10-2006, 11:36 PM
May I ask who that question is directed at, my kind sir? you are the only 14 year old here....

tybrenis
06-10-2006, 11:52 PM
I beg to differ.

According to this (http://thebestcasescenario.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1050) poll, I am in the most popular age group. Though I must say, if any of my idiot friends came on here it would be a disaster, so I vouch for the utter stupidity of kids my age (sorry other young members).

And if I remember correctly, you're still a teen yourself, aren't you?

MrSlacker
06-10-2006, 11:54 PM
I beg to differ.

There's a poll on here somewhere, there are a lot of young kids on here. And if I remember correctly, you're still a teen yourself, aren't you?
Yes I am.. but I am not 14 year old making threads about beating up emo kids. I am not emo, nor i like them, but if i saw u beating them, i'd throw ur ass out the window

tybrenis
06-10-2006, 11:56 PM
Yes I am.. but I am not 14 year old making threads about beating up emo kids. I am not emo, nor i like them, but if i saw u beating them, i'd throw ur ass out the window

Twas a joke, twas a joke.

You seriously think I'm beating up emo kids? Comon' now...

The kind of kids that do that are not the kind of kids that come onto modding forums and talk about electronic engineering.

Omega
06-11-2006, 12:48 AM
I beg to differ.

According to this (http://thebestcasescenario.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1050) poll, I am in the most popular age group.


Nothing in that poll says that the people in that specific group are all 14, or rather, that any of them aside from you are.

I know for a fact that i am 15, and still in your "age group".

Rankenphile
06-11-2006, 12:52 AM
is this completely necessary?

Omega
06-11-2006, 01:24 AM
Ranken, this is the internet.

GT40_GearHead
06-11-2006, 02:32 AM
damn this **** is a train wreck
(talking about the thread; from emo to goth to nazis to age groups)

Drew
06-11-2006, 06:06 AM
Woo hoooooooo!

I learnt what an emo is!!!!!

I call 'em 'bloody annoyances', but each to their own....

Let the runaway train continue!

Drew

xmastree
06-11-2006, 06:45 AM
As the resident old fart here, I should take you all outside and give you a good spanking.

However, in this day and age, I'd probably be arrested for child molestation, so I'll bang your heads together instead. :)

There's probably a forum somewhere having a similar debate about beating up geeks...

GT40_GearHead
06-11-2006, 06:56 AM
As the resident old fart here, I should take you all outside and give you a good spanking.

However, in this day and age, I'd probably be arrested for child molestation, so I'll bang your heads together instead. :)

There's probably a forum somewhere having a similar debate about beating up geeks...


damn it xmastree you wanna get killed for heresy, =)) =)) lol
the run away train just got in the child molestation zone
ps: xmas... lock youre doors get a gun, get in youre house, they're coming for you be prepered i cant save you're lost soul

xmastree
06-11-2006, 08:52 AM
Go ahead, make my day:

http://www.lotechdesigns.com/host/images/9732IPSCshooter.jpg

Yes, that's me...

tybrenis
06-11-2006, 10:31 AM
Hey Rank, can we close this thread? It is a serious train wreck getting more attention than necessary.

nil8
06-11-2006, 03:40 PM
The stupid just keeps piling up.

Ty, as said in the crazy thread about 3 weeks ago, don't ask for it to be closed. Use the report thread button.

Slug Toy
06-11-2006, 03:49 PM
well while the thread is still open, ill say this.

holy crap xmas, you got some sort of anti-aircraft luger from the looks of it.

GT40_GearHead
06-11-2006, 04:34 PM
damn dude
what caliber ??? what range
<edit> 1)you see?? now we got guns LOL
2)know what guys, dont kill this thread, is to damn funny

AKA_RA
06-11-2006, 04:40 PM
seriosuly, whats the harm in having a random thread like this? not only is it funny, its informitive :D
oh, and xmastree, what kind of gun is that exactly, it looks like you put a scope on a highly modded nintendo zapper. but it still looks bitchen, and wouldnt mind gettin me one of those. lol

xmastree
06-11-2006, 08:29 PM
It's a STI/Caspian .38 Super semi-auto. Ported and compensated, with a red dot sight. It's not a scope, as t doesn't enlarge the image. It simply puts the illusion of a red dot on the target.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.38_Super
http://xmastree.34sp.com/STI/

Omega
06-11-2006, 10:37 PM
woah, xmas's picture is in wikipedia =D