Regurgetated Amway?

[CanaBalistic]

I was recently contacted by a friend of mine who went to our local home show. He told me about a business opertuity to make some extra cash. I was delighted to hear such a praposal. He set up a meeting at his house on tuesday night. At this meeting i was introducted to a company called QuixTar. I heard promises that if i put just a little effort and a few hours a week, That a 6 figure income was not hard to obtain. The man showed me pictures of himself and the higher up's on private jets.

The deal is this. If you sign up for $100 you "become" an independant business owner (IBO) and pay $50 per month to maintain your online retail mall. The product rage is quite extensive. The retail "system" is based on a points system. For every $3 spent at your online mall you recieve 1 PV point. Once you've reached 200PV the payout is $195 minus your website fee. Youve just turned a profit asuming you can sell $600 worth of product off your website each month. They then tell you that if you become a "pro-sumer" and purchase from yourself that your costs drop dramaticly. The idea behind this is that your going to need dish soap, socks, pots & pans. If you buy from yourself at wholesale, you still get the PV points and enjoy further saving by getting the items at whole sale.

Here's the catch 22, You can earn a share of other peoples profits if you sign them up to be online retailers. He then goes on to say if you recruit 6 people underneath you to do the same thing you are and if they maintain 200 PV in thier website sales you'll earn $800 per month just off the sales of the people below you.

Now when i heard this i was not at all skeptical. I had no doupt in my mind that this was the ticket to success and riches beyond my wildest dreams. He set up a follow up meeting 2 days later (yesterday). As i still had to go work at my job, there wasnt time to do much research. I did however manage to find some valuable information. As it turns out, QuixTar is a sister company to Amway. A few years back Amway was investigated by the government for being a pyramid scheme. It was fined and eventually closed down. At almost the same time as Amway went under, QuixTar emerged. Both Amway and QuixTar are daughter company's of one Alticore inc.

Now when i held the fallow up meeting at my apartment i brought up a DateLine Special on which Hannsen tracks the scheme. When this guy heard this he immediatly asked me if i believe everything i see on tv and the internet. Of course i had to say no. He then brought up that there are thousands of hate sites for Mother Tresea, IBM, Microsoft. He wrote off everyone as being somone who tried the program and faild. He called them people who couldnt hack it in the system. Now when i adressed this as being a scham, he looked a little mad and told me if i wasnt the guy for this that there were hundres of other waiting to take my place. He thought it wise to add the old saying "the train is leaving the station, are you onboard" as if i didnt jump on this immediatly that i wouldnt get the chance again. His explination as to why this was not a pyramid was that if i became richer that he was i would jump ahead of him and take his spot in the pyramid (ironicly he used the same pyramid diagram he perviously used to show me how a pyramid was constructed).

I am still unsure if it is wise choice to participate in this program.
In my heart i feel its a pyramid scheme but on the same token i know the government would shut it down if they were.
The exagurated claims of riches are very hard to ignore.

Has anyone hear had anyexperience with Amway or QuixTar or participated in a pyramid or other simmilar scheme?

Please help

[Omega]

All i will say is that i don't think that you should do it, but hell, it's your money.

[CanaBalistic]

If you heard one sentence from this guy you'd be hooked yourself.

The fact that the guy tells you that you'll have to leave some friends and family behind (the non-believers) makes me very weary...
I found a site with useful information if anyone cares to read it.
http://www.amquix.info/

Im going to wait and see if my friend makes it. if he does, i might give it a shot.

[Omega]

If you heard one sentence from this guy you'd be hooked yourself.

The fact that the guy tells you that you'll have to leave some friends and family behind (the non-believers) makes me very weary...
I found a site with useful information if anyone cares to read it.
http://www.amquix.info/

Im going to wait and see if my friend makes it. if he does, i might give it a shot.


I'm not easily persuaded by cheesy sales pitches claiming i can make tons of money.

[CanaBalistic]

I didnt think so either... I thought of myself as a rock. Uncrackable.

Question: Is it illegal for me to ask this guy for his finacial records like his tax return or list of online sales to see if he's really worth what he says he is?

[AKA_RA]

If you heard one sentence from this guy you'd be hooked yourself.

The fact that the guy tells you that you'll have to leave some friends and family behind (the non-believers) makes me very weary...
I found a site with useful information if anyone cares to read it.
http://www.amquix.info/

Im going to wait and see if my friend makes it. if he does, i might give it a shot.

Leaving family and friends behind? Non-believers? I'm starting to wonder, is this a scam or a cult?

[Rankenphile]

I'm telling you right now, as sincerely as possible - do NOT get involved in this. This is an absolute pyramid scheme, is barely legal and you will not - will not - make money doing this. I have seen this same basic scheme in a half-dozen other forms, and seen people who have gone in on these schemes super enthusiastic, and who end up never making a dime on it.

Why would they charge you money if you are actively going out and selling their products for them? Why would they not be offering you a straight commission on selling their products if they are making money on them? How many other people do you know, other than your friend, who have purchased their products or made money in this company?

This is a scam, pure and simple. Do not participate in this.

[CanaBalistic]

AKA RA: There is actually a site out there devoted to proving that this is a cult....

Rankin: I've never heard of this ever before in my life. Hell i didnt even know about amway untill a few days ago.


Ill ask the rep if i can see his tax return or sales figures. If he refuses or gives me a run around. I wont participate.

Another thing is my buddy, i care about him alot and i dont want to see him get shafted either. He is coming over on sunday, ill voice my concerns to him but i dont know that its going to sway him. I guess only time will tell.

Thank you, everyone for your very valued input on this grevous matter. Ill repost on sunday after the meeting.

[DaveW]

This is a scam, pure and simple. Do not participate in this.

Rankenphile said it. These things are very dangerous-don't take the risk. Ask yourself if you've ever been to a website that's a member of this scheme. Most folks only buy from trusted websites online; you won't get customers, you'll lose your money, and by the sounds of it, a whole lot more.

This is NOT something you want to be associated with. Pass this up without ever thinking about it again. That's my advice.

Oh, and for the record, the internet and television were created for the purpose of spreading information. (Well...not strictly true, but anyway) I'd sooner trust the internet, the voices of millions of people, over what some jackass with a clean suit, stupid diagrams, and a louse sales pitch says anyday.

-Dave

[FyR]

Dont do it man, the only people who earn money from pyramid scemes is the person at the top. This is pretty much the same deal as the free ipod sites ALL over the net, you subscribe to the site and give £15 or whatever, then you have to get 15 friends to subscribe aswell (each donating £15) then they do the same.

Look on e-bay - the net is writhe with people trying to make a quick buck and willing to rip of decent people like you and your friend without a second thought. My advice to you - dont even open the door to him, once hes inside he's 50% on his way to persueding you...Actually...no, let him in... and attack him with a dremel.

If it seems to good to be true, it probably is. Nothing good comes easily.

[Rankenphile]

no, let him in... and attack him with a dremel.

If it seems to good to be true, it probably is. Nothing good comes easily.

quoted for truth.

both parts.

[Cevinzol]

its a pyramid scam.
the fact that he got pissed when you suggested it. PROVES it.
DON'T waste your money!!

[Omega]

Oh, another pointer, although not as reliable, is the website.

Notice almost all lack of structure, probably spelling errors, and alot of extra crap? Yeah. Good website's don't have that. And good companies have good websites. Because the have good webadmins.


I would much rather trust someplace that looks like Otakuland (http://www.thebornotaku.co.nr is otakuland) than THAT site.


=p

[maximan1]

I would say its a scam. It might work for some people but not most. I would go out and get another job with more chances of getting less stressed and more money than wasting money on a scam like such.

[Drew]

My tuppence worth.

These companies tend to employ very, very good salespeople, almost like the 'cult brain-washers'.

Sounds to me like your mate has been got by the bogeyman. He sincerely thinks he's gonna make a mint, and in his mind (as told by the salesperson), he feels he is actually doing you a favour.

If he decides you're a muppet for not joining in (which he will), let him have his strop and clear off. He'll be back.

All you can do is wait for him (if you care that much).

He's a victim too. Gullible and greedy maybe, but a victim.

Just try not to say 'Told you so' when the house of cards come tumbling down.

I was stung by one of these before, the lads are very good at what they do (preying on the naieve, gullible and desperate).

Good luck.

Drew

:edit: And I meant no offence with the 'naieve, gullible, greedy and desperate' bit.....'

[GT40_GearHead]

dont do it man, there was a **** like this in romania, lots of people lost everything, money, houses, family, and so on, its no way you aint geting screwed, on top of that: if the **** house comes down they are ganna drag you in to. I know people that tried this thing, they didn't got crap and lost a lot of money DONT DO IT

[CanaBalistic]

Oh, another pointer, although not as reliable, is the website.

Notice almost all lack of structure, probably spelling errors, and alot of extra crap? Yeah. Good website's don't have that. And good companies have good websites. Because the have good webadmins.


I would much rather trust someplace that looks like Otakuland (http://www.thebornotaku.co.nr is otakuland) than THAT site.


=p
That website was created to inform and is not the main site of the program

www.quixtar.com <-- the main website for quixtar
http://www.quixtarfacts.com/
http://www.alticor.com/ <-- parent company of amway & quixtar
http://www.ibofacts.com/
http://www.wwdb.biz/
http://lotsostuff.wwdb.biz/ <-- the website my buddy got but it requires a code to get in the door

They are listed in the Better Business Bureau
From BBB website:

with the Bureau. A satisfactory record
BBB Definition:

satisfactory record - A business identified in our report as satisfactory has, based on Bureau files, been in business for at least one year, and has voluntarily provided the Bureau with all information requested about the business and its product or service. If any complaints have been received about the business, their number has not been considered by the BBB to be extreme, given the nature of the company's business and the volume of business transacted. Complaints are also generally typical of what might be expected for this type of business. A business stated to be satisfactory has not been the subject of any recent law enforcement actions concerning its dealings with the public. If the business has been contacted by the BBB about its advertising or selling claims, it has modified or substantiated its practices to the Bureau's satisfaction. In addition, the BBB has a clear understanding of the company's business, and the business is not in an industry which has raised significant marketplace concerns.


means a company has been in business for at least 12 months, and properly addressed matters referred by the Bureau. The company does not have an unusual volume of complaints, or any government actions involving its marketplace conduct. The Bureau understands and has no concerns about the company's products, services and type of business.

The Bureau processed a total of 0 complaints about this company in the last 36 months, our standard reporting period.

[Drew]

You work for em?

Drew

:edit: joking......

[CanaBalistic]

They want to recruit me but it sounds like a pyramid scheme

[jdbnsn]

Hi Cana-Balsitic,

I actually have quite alot of experience with Amway and like-minded organizations. I have been approached by at least 20 very determined recruiters, attended 3 seminars (at which we were shown extremely exciting videos with "diamond" members boarding their private learjets) and have actually engaged in a physical altercation with one recruiter. Why so much exposure you ask? My second roommate became enthusiastically involved in Amway because his older brother (late 30's) drew him in. His brother was a very charismatic person with uncountable friends around town. The roommate (Travis) used to spend all evening explaining to me how simple it all was and how extremely profitable it was, it was like getting free money. We argued until breathless about it's value as a way to earn money until I finally agreed that I could not fairly dispute it without exploring it more closely. So I agreed to attend the free seminar's and listen to what they had to say. The truth is, and I have seen this mentioned several times, is that the business is legitimate as long as it provides some service or product for the exchange of money. The government outlawed the first pyramids which sold nothing but only exchanged money (i.e. first you pay $200 to get your name on a list, then you get 6 people to do the same, then your 6 people etc....). But Amway and it's sister corporations eluded closure for many years by selling products. The bottom line in all of this is yes it is possible to make money in this business, but it is very, very difficult. You can literally spend decades busting your ass to start earning any money, and even when you do, it's not much. They probably paraded a group of "seniors or expert earners" infront of you or at least displayed some of their remarkable earnings yes? These people may be exceptions and are the same examples being used across the GLOBE (I actually was led into a room during a tour of Zhou Zhaung in China and the doors were locked while we were told how to make fortunes selling amway "pearl cream"). It is very cult-like as you have witnessed the rep respond to your apprehensiveness with an emotional outburst and a quick attempt to squash your fears and get you "on board", you also correctly noticed his use of time pressure as if the offer would expire-bull****! Follow you insticts here and don't waste you time, you will make much more money working fast food than this program, it is almost certain failure. Oh, and the lack of complaints? You said the company hasn't been around long right? Most of the people have two fates, one: they are still busting their asses like your rep friend trying to recruit, or two: they have lost their asses and wasted a year chasing a wet dream and are far to embarrassed to file a formal complaint (reprocussions from amway complaints were legendary-very much like Scientology). By the way, my ex-roomate worked on this for 2-3 years without making one single dime, his brother (who had the gazillion friends and should have easily become a millionaire), not one dime. Both went broke, one went to jail for spousal abuse after becoming a drug addict (common end point for dealing with extraordinary shame). Trust your friends and that gut feeling, just shake his hand, smile, and politely decline. Trust me on this, I really do know these people.
Jon

[jdbnsn]

Oh I forgot to mention something. The method. Someone else was talking about this also, but how many people do you know who actually buy their products? Any? So where is all of this money coming from to buy the learjets? Before it was the "start-up fee" to cover the expense of your order slips, stationary, reciept booklets, etc...Basically, things you could easily get elsewhere. But if you suggest buying them elsewhere, you will find that you can only participate if you buy these trivial items from them. Now it appears they have moved on to web-page startup fees, I'll bet you that 75% of the members on this forum could start their own web-based mall with a little research and a few weekends perhaps. But I'll bet you're not allowed to develop your own site, but must purchase their kit. This is just like a franchise fee, but far less honest because a franchise fee is plainly paying to put a name on your building that is garunteed to draw a certain amount of people, this is just selling you things you can get for free under the guise of necessary expenses. Don't bother with his financial records, they may very well be impecable. If it is such a sure thing, ask him to front you the startup up expenses since he with most certainly get them back once you start raking in the cash. Or tell him that you can start your own webmall without their startup kit, then watch the expression on his face. He'll be searching his tiny noodle for a rational explaination as to why you "must" use their kit. Then ask him if you are so certain to profit, why would he hesitate to cover your expenses, just until you get on your feet that is, it's money in the bank right? So that is where it fits in as a pyramid scheme, but instead of just giving someone $200, you get your trivial startup materials and then never use them again because all of your future energy will be spent trying to recruit others to "multiply your earning potential" sound familiar? So, since they are selling you free website templates, the gov. has more trouble defaulting them as a pyramid scheme, but it is the exact same principle, and the exact same people behind it. These predators make me sick. Oh yeah, one last note. The physical altercation? I beat the **** out a man who successfully talked one of my close friends (also one of the smartest people I knew, at least in some ways) into dropping out of the pre-medical program in college so he would have more time on his hands to recruit. I was so furious because he ruined my friends life overnight and he never went back to school. What I did was wrong and illegal, and I paid for it, but it goes to show how much they really do care for their recruits.

[Omega]

WORDS


JESUS CHRIST, SENTENCE STRUCTURE IS YOUR FRIEND.

[jdbnsn]

JESUS CHRIST, SENTENCE STRUCTURE IS YOUR FRIEND.

Thanks for the grammar help, I've been awake for 72 hours studying relatively nonstop for the boards exam which is in 4 hours. Sentence structure is probably more important to me when I'm not in the middle of a caffiene fueled delerious rant. But you're right none-the-less, maybe next time eh?
Jon

[XcOM]

Full stop, colons, paragraphs. ENGLISH

[DaveW]

Full stop, colons, paragraphs. ENGLISH

You forgot one: Grammar! Full stop should be plural, and ENGLISH should either have an exclamation mark or a full stop.

;)

-Dave

[jdbnsn]

You forgot one: Grammar! Full stop should be plural, and ENGLISH should either have an exclamation mark or a full stop.

;)

-Dave


HeeHee...Immmm baaaacccckkk (sp?)

Wow, 400 questions in eight hours and it weren't nothin nice! That was one hard SOB of an exam, I just hope I passed that mutha because I have probably slept a total of 8 hours in the last week and spent $500 to take the damn thing. If you fail, you can't even move on to the rotations and catch it 6 mo later anymore, it must be passed before you check in for rotation (which actually makes alot more sense anyway). Pray for me ya'll, cause now I have an hour drive to get home and I'm getting sleeeeeeepy.:(