View Full Version : creative troubles

Slug Toy
06-12-2006, 11:34 PM
i cant believe i of all people am at a lack of ideas here. i have to turn to you guys for ideas on this.

ok, first a little speel to get everyone up to date. remember that zanzibar mod? i had a severe falling out with a friend who was an absolute halo freak. it pretty much put me off halo completely. in fact, i havent touched a computer game for about a month now. ive managed to keep busy with school, the gym, and random discussion/arguments here on the forums. im not into that zanzibar mod anymore, i stare at the frame for literally hours, just hating it.

im switching gears for this. im going to do something very techy and purpose built. i know the types of things i want in it... air cleaner, dehumidifier (ive got some magnesium silicate desicant pellets for it), watercooling... ive pretty much got all the individual components thought out. id also like to do some acrylic work like in tribal's liquid evolution threads.... well, same effect, but not the same style. heres where i need the help though. i want to theme this case if possible, but i really dont know of a movie or game, or anything that is both techy and purpose built. i cant find anything that just stands out and says "im a kickass idea". i was thinking the tv series firefly, or the movie serenity might be a good way to go, but im just not sure right now.

does anybody have anything awesome? im completely open to suggestions right now, so just start flooding me with ideas if you have them.

Slug Toy
06-13-2006, 10:41 PM
nothing yet? having as much trouble as i am?

i did think of another idea. perhaps the necro monger type technology in chronicles of riddick.

still, nothing is really jumping out at me though. im listening here...... still listening. anyone with a good idea better post before i go and tear all my hair out and start on expendable appendages.

06-14-2006, 02:59 AM
How about optical illusions? I've seen some cases with mirrors so that it looks like an empty box. You could build a case that is a total trip to look at. People will look at pic and it will look one way, you show another angle and they don't know what they are looking at.

This one is pretty cool. I'm not suggesting that you use this, but it is cool.
Look at it close to your screen and then slowly walk away and see how the two images change.

06-14-2006, 12:22 PM
I'll tell you what, if you have played any of the games in the Myst Series (I.e. myst, riven, etc...) you will find volumes of structures that you surely will find some inspiration from. Lots of things that are immediately purposeful, beautiful, complex, and creative. You might check those out for some ideas.
Good luck!

06-14-2006, 01:31 PM
Hmmm... well, I had a similar problem. So I just wrote my own back story :p.

Lets see, techy...hmmm. Matrix comes to mind. You could even extrapolate on the machines and do something you think would be in their city.

Or...Star Wars. Like the design of the hallways, I think they had white lights that went from ground to ceiling.
Are you a Star trek fan? They had alot of places for inspiration.

Wait I got it. How about Men in Black. Most of their stuff was very techy and could be given many lighting effects. It really up to you. Thats about all I can think of right now though.

Slug Toy
06-14-2006, 06:23 PM
You could even extrapolate on the machines

thats probably what ill end up doing, although i need a place to start from first. not a huge star trek fan unfortunately... although if i see something i like, it doesnt really matter where it came from. i was also thinking about the matrix and MIB. they're all valid right now, BUT....

the Myst Series (I.e. myst, riven, etc...)

... ill have to take a look at this first. i remember seeing ads for uru.... i think thats one of the series, and i remember thinking it looked interesting. never even seen the game though. ill look at some screenshots if i can find them.

those optical illusions are interesting too. im thinking of perhaps using some nifty angled acrylic pieces to refract and reflect light so maybe i can give the illusion of duplicated or hidden pieces. ive got to look into it though. depends on what the refraction coefficient for acrylic is. if it carries light along the edges, im sure you can do some neat effects.

Slug Toy
06-17-2006, 11:53 PM
alright, ive kind of settled on the fact that i nothing is going to inspire me to theme this case. ill just go ahead with some sort of abstract tech design.

speaking of abstract tech designs, im drawing one up right now. i just downloaded sketch up too, so ill try to transfer the drawing on to the computer and post some shots. then ill open up to design suggestions if there are any.

ill need a little while to do this because ive never used sketch up before.

Slug Toy
06-18-2006, 10:54 PM
little update.... I LOVE SKETCH UP!!!!

this is working very very very very very well, and i can finally show my ideas without settling for crappy scans of drawings.

the case is looking like an angular giant, more akin to a delorean, but its not done yet. fingers crossed for tomorrow night or something, its taking a long time to measure everything and get it right. i just have one side, and a water cooling schematic left, but they kind of tie into each other so its like a water-wall.

ive got to take some time out now to do two projects.... bloody school!!!! census project tonight, powerpoint tomorrow. then.... if i have time, computer.

worth the wait though... i love what ive got done so far, and i think some of you will too.

06-19-2006, 06:48 AM
So...I just had a bad weekend (bad = hungover) and raided my DVD rack for something I hadn't seen in *ages*. What did I come across? Why am I posting here?

HACKERS! That horrible movie with Anjie Jolie and no one else of consequence. :) Anyway, it'd be great to (I was thinking of it for a future mod) do a homage to "Crash & Burn".

Okay...rather horrible idea now that I reread it...but...I'm clicking post anyway!

06-19-2006, 08:25 AM
That picture is sweet.

Johnny Lee Miller is a decent actor and he's in Hackers.

Can't wait to see the sketches slug.

Slug Toy
06-19-2006, 11:21 PM
hey, you guys are in luck, im done!!! and if i do say so myself, i have thought up one slick looking case. ill get right to it.


so first, the colours. anything that is blue will be tinted blue acrylic with some super bright whites behind it, or if i cant find any blue acrylic, it will be clear acrylic with blue lighting. anything that is grey will be aluminum. the materials are subject to change though. if i can get my hands on some copper, ill throw that in too, and ill probably throw some styrene in there too. ill figure the materials out as i go....

and the numbers:

1. case air exhaust shroud

2. power button

3. water cooling air intake

4. air entry to water-wall (that whole side is going to house a large radiator)

5. a modded top loading optical drive of some sort (as luck would have it, i think my dvd rom just packed it in, so i can practice modding it first)

6. water cooling hot water input

7. water cooling cold water output

8. case air intake (the left hand wall) and air transfer (the air goes into that large circle thing, down, and then up out of the floor of the case)

9. a 5.25" bay, a floppy bay, and peripherals


10. water cooling air exhaust port

11. the watercooling intake housing (rear view)


so if you can gather from these pictures, its definitely going to be clean and organized. ive got case air and water cooling air separated, and (logically) routed to minimize turbulence (hopefully).

the case air goes in the left hand wall, down to the bottom, then out a set of vents, up though the case, and out the rear of the top. it will be pushed by the largest fans i can fit in there (modded fans of course, i dont want too much noise, and i dont want the square housing they come in). theres going to be a large network of air filters and chemical dessicants in the left hand wall, and that is why im using such a large area just for the intake. it will reduce resistance.

as for the water cooling air supply, it goes in the front vents, into the right hand wall, does its stuff in the wall, and then out the back of that right hand wall. and again, it will be pushed by big modded fans. there will be air filters for the air intake here too, but no dessicants, because moisture wont matter to me if its in the radiator area. if anything, a little condensation (if any) will evapourate and help cool.

now, you may be looking at numbers 6 and 7 (the input and output to the radiator) and wondering why there are six holes in the top one and only one hole on the bottom. the answer is a stroke of genius in my opinion. this is going to be a 6-loop cooling system. there will be a dedicated loop for the CPU, one for the GPU, one for the RAM, one for the chipset, one for the other internals (hard drives and anything else i add), and one lone redundant cooling loop that cycles directly through the radiator again to further cool (i could also use this as a spare if i ever add another piece of hardware that needs good cooling). so each device sends its hot water to the radiator, and once the water has cooled, it comes out in one lone tube at the bottom, heading for the pump. this brings up another question... how am i going to pump all this water?

the pump answer is another stroke of genius. there will be one large motor that powers an acrylic version of a straight-six motor. there will be one cylinder for each loop, and that will allow for a dependable flow and pressure for each loop. yes, this means the water will travel in pulses, but i may make it a two-way design where as water is pushed out one end, it also enters the other end... we'll see, it may be hard to do. if i cant make a two way pump, ill just make the cylinders large.

at this point, i havent been able to make up a 3D design of the water pump, or a schematic for how ill run the cooling pipes. ill be working on that over the next week. i cant spend a lot of time on it right now because not only do i have these damn projects, i have two midterms this week, and one next week.

so anyways.... comments? questions? suggestions? criticism? anything? i realize this is very ambitious... but i need to make up for my zanzibar failure... thats my only defense for that.

Slug Toy
06-23-2006, 01:40 AM
right, heres my plan for the pump that i was talking about.


so, the numbers thing again:

1. the cylinder block, one cylinder per loop in the cooling system

2. the manifold so to speak, where the water will go in and out

3. the reservoir

4. outputs on the manifold, water goes out through them

5. inputs on manifold, water goes in

6. outputs on reservoir, water goes out them, and to the inputs on the manifold

7. main input to the reservoir, straight from radiator

i didnt really feel like drawing up the actual pistons or crankshaft that will go along with this thing... you can get the idea if you know what the internals of an engine look like.

so i think what ill do is have a one way valve on each input.output on hte manifold so the water doesnt get all backed up. simple enough if i can find some... if i cant ill have to make some out of something flexible. i bet i can find some though.

a big question for this is how am i going to get this thing water tight. honestly, i dont know right now. im running through a lot of ideas for it. one thing i could do is put a silicone ring around the pistons, so if forms a mushy and flexible seal inside the cylinder, and that may be the simplest. there are a couple others, but im not going to get into them. im very tired right now... did a presentation in school today, and i pwned the pants off a bio midterm, and no sleep last night.

im going to leave it at this for now. maybe if anyone has an idea to get the pump water tight without too much fancy footwork... that would help a lot. ill wait a while to see if anyone says anything, and maybe ill revise some of the designs over the weekend... i want to make sure everything jives before i start. so if you dont have anything to say... pay attention anyways, i may have a new case/pump design in the future. ill at least add some more detail.

06-23-2006, 02:03 AM
nice i had this idea a few years a go, you dont need nothing for sealing it, you just have to run oil through the sistem, dont get me wrong, i mean through the crankshaft, the pistons will seal them selfs, you know, the oil gets between the cilinder rings, for sealing the manifold you should use a simple manifold sealing thingy. But there is one problem, how the f#&% are you gonna crank it up, you gonna need a big thing.
BTW: what engine will you use

Slug Toy
06-23-2006, 02:21 AM
oh, haha, i wont use a real engine, im going to make one out of acrylic, so the cylinders will probably be about 2 inches in diameter. ill just power it off a 12 volt motor... i can probably find one somewhere.

hopefully the oil might work the same way no matter what material. i like that idea, i was just pondering it before you mentioned it. it would allow a design change to simplify even further, and make a sort of hybrid 2 stroke based design with the valves in the piston itself.

but it may change things now that you know its not a real engine.

im going to keep thinking about it. im not done for the night yet. im just trying to idle a bit.

06-23-2006, 10:51 AM
and make a sort of hybrid 2 stroke based design with the valves in the piston itself.

what do you mean valves in the piston :? make a sketch
glad you like my oily idea :D

Slug Toy
06-23-2006, 04:27 PM
this is what im thinking about, i only did one cylinder because all six will be identical.


numbers again:

1. the top of the cylinder, with the output

2. this is pointing to the piston

3. these are the valves in the piston

4. this is a "conrod" that probably wont be hinged in the normal way, i think i have an idea to help minimize leaking

5. the input hole

so what happens in this design is the water/oil will go in through the input at the bottom. when the piston comes down, the water goes up through the two valves, and into the other side of the cylinder. when the piston goes up, the two valves close, and the water is forced up and out the output.

this particular design can be easily modified to be a one stroke as well. you just need an input and output on each side of the piston, and presto.

honestly, im still not completely impressed with what i have so far. i still get the feeling that leaks will happen. more thinking to do... going good so far though.

06-23-2006, 05:16 PM
looking forward to see how you wil actually do it in the end ;)
I like the idea of this pump...
only thing I'm concerned about is (like you said) the 'flow' won't be constant...
nevertheless, great idea! keep it up

06-23-2006, 06:01 PM
this is what im thinking about, i only did one cylinder because all six will be identical.


numbers again:

1. the top of the cylinder, with the output

2. this is pointing to the piston

3. these are the valves in the piston

4. this is a "conrod" that probably wont be hinged in the normal way, i think i have an idea to help minimize leaking

5. the input hole

so what happens in this design is the water/oil will go in through the input at the bottom. when the piston comes down, the water goes up through the two valves, and into the other side of the cylinder. when the piston goes up, the two valves close, and the water is forced up and out the output.

this particular design can be easily modified to be a one stroke as well. you just need an input and output on each side of the piston, and presto.

honestly, im still not completely impressed with what i have so far. i still get the feeling that leaks will happen. more thinking to do... going good so far though.

well now i get it but i dont agree, you see, in that configuration you will use (corect me if i'm wrong) 4 valves, 2 on the piston and 2 on the body (block)
the most easy way in my mind is to use 2 one way valves on the manifold(you do know how it worcks), this way you dont need to dril the cilinder, less holes less problems, and i think that you should try to reproduce a car engine, you take a plex tube on one end glue a round bit of plex, dril the plex tube from side to side to make room for youre push rod bolt, make the bolt(plex), make the push rod(plex), for the crank shaft... well it 12 AM in here so.... you get my point :p
ooooww and there is no problem with the flow as long as you got more then one cilinder, 2 for example will work great, one is sucking the other is pushing
if you need something just say so, you just hapened to get in my line of knowledge :D

Slug Toy
06-24-2006, 01:38 AM
well now i get it but i dont agree

you know what, you're right. that two stroke idea doesnt make any damn sense. looking at it now... its a more primitive design, but it doesnt mean its any easier to make. screw that crap.

so im back to my first pump idea. i dont like how bulky it looks though. im going to refine it over the weekend, see if i can meld things together to cut the size down. i mean, keeping to the scale in the model, if i want any sort of acceptable flow rate, that pump is going to be at least a foot long, half a foot high, and 3 inches wide. i dont know if i can spare that space. ive already got ideas though. im finally getting my creativity back. just one midterm left, and hell week is over... two projects and two exams done this week alone, but i did kick some serious ass.

you just hapened to get in my line of knowledge

a fellow motor guy? i did some motor courses a few years ago. i was the only one who actually knew wtf was going on. i got 100% and i was always the fastest to tear those babies down and get them back together and running. i even managed to fix 60 year old chainsaw. do you design them or just work on them? i particularly like the design part.... in grade 10 i designed a new type of rotary engine, but i dont know if it would work.

06-24-2006, 02:44 AM
well i dont design, but when you wanna built a Remote controle toy with 4 cilinder boxer aprox 90BHP.... yeea you could say i worck with them, i lust love engins i have a truck differential on my desk what can i say

ouuuu and about the design i see you got some skils, if you want 6 cilinders, put 3 side by side ... like this:
the 2 round things are the two pulleys where you could put a belt drive
i this setup you get half the size
sorry for my sketchup skilz, or lack of them :(

Slug Toy
06-24-2006, 03:09 AM
i was thinking about 3 side by side to get 6. its a possibility, but it adds a little bit of complexity. im not quite there yet... my thoughts progress to things like that over time, but a week isnt enough. im sure ill eventually be talking about some sort of W-motor.... thats actually not a bad idea... a W-motor (i cant remember the name, but its got three cylinders 30 degrees apart instead of 2 at 90 or 60 degrees). see, ill get there, just give me a few more days to think things through.

now, remember i said i had some ideas to simplify and downsize things?



1. output, water goes out from here, each cylider has one, and each one has a valve

2. cylinder input, just a hole, no valve, ill probably have more than two per cylinder to reduce resistance

3. hole to make a route between the cylnder block and the top block

4. same as number 3, 3 and 4 join up

5. master input to the cylinder block

ok, i think this may be the best design yet. ill walk you through it. water comes in from the radiator, and goes into the master input, and into the cylinder block. the cylinder block will be made of tubes inside of a box, so there will be space for water to be in there, and not just in the cylinders (this is because the cylinder block will act as a reservoir too). so the water is in the cylinder block, and it travels up through numbers 3 and 4, to get into the top block. the top block also acts as a small reservoir. once the water is in the top block, it goes through the cylinder inputs, and then gets pumped out of the output. one thing i did realize while writing this is ill need walls in the top block to separate each cylinder, or they'll just start transferring water to each other within the pump, and nothing will actually come out.

so this works out to a fairly simple design with the least number of moving parts yet. one master input with a valve, and 6 outputs with vavles... 7 valves. compare that to my first design (12 vavles) and my two stroke crap design (24 valves at the very least) and we have a clear winner so far.

ive got the efficiency of flow pretty much down in my mind now. ill start working on actual cylinder layout now. there are a few ways to do this, and it all depends on what uses the least moving parts again.

06-24-2006, 05:41 AM
you my man just climb a notch in my book with this idea, its great i love it(using the block as a res that is sweeet,but i'm not shure if it's gonna with the one master input valve setup.....let me think i'm not shure, the valve may not have time to close), now the hard part: crankshaft

06-24-2006, 07:08 AM
don't you need more valves? the water flows into the cilinder when the piston goes down, but if you don't have valves at the cilinder inputs (2 in your picture) the water/oil will flow back into the resevoir instead of going out through the output-port (1)
Or am I missing something?

Slug Toy
06-24-2006, 03:53 PM
but i'm not shure if it's gonna with the one master input valve

the design will evolve... all will be solved in time.

don't you need more valves?

in my perfect world, no. the idea would be that as each piston goes down, it increases the volume inside the pump, and the master valve would open. when each piston is a bdc (bottom dead center) the volume is no longer increasing and the master valve would close (no more water flowing in to make it open). then when the piston starts going back up, ideally, the water will go up into the output...... hmmmm.

i just ran through a couple cycles of the pump in my mind. even with a wall in the top block separating each cylinder, the water will still backtrack through the valveless holes. uh oh. now its a necessary design evolution again....

thats what i get for designing at 1 in the morning.. see why my roatry engine probably wouldnt work?

06-24-2006, 04:34 PM
thats what i get for designing at 1 in the morning.. see why my roatry engine probably wouldnt work?

the water will still backtrack through the valveless holes

lol, you see what i mean, i'm looking at it the only thing that comes to my mind is OVER-HEAD valves,its the most simple way , but still using the block as a res (love that one), and a nother thing, we are twistng our brains on the valves setup for some time but what about the crackshaft,are you gonna push the pistons one at a time or in pairs(the one by one setup is in my head the best otherwise you could get..... bad suction... i'm shure there is a word for this hmmm "cavitation"?:? )

BTW: know what you should do? you should make a protype, a 2 cilinder one, the best way to test things

Slug Toy
06-24-2006, 04:47 PM
ive got the valves straightened away now


some of it is the same:

1. master input, this time no valve

2. the holes to make a route into the top black again, still no valve

3. cylinder output, one valve each

4. cylinder input, one valve each

so, it works the same way, except this time the design is a sure fire thing. i KNOW it will work. of course, there still will be changes, just for the heck of it. ill probably think of something cool to do.

what about the crackshaft

well that is the next step now. im leaving the valves alone for a while, i dont think its getting any better than what it is at the moment. ive boiled the crankshaft down to two possibilities. in terms of the least moving parts, a hexagonal setup with each cylinder 60 degrees apart is easiest. this will allow for a single section to run all the cylinders.

in terms of space saving, the W setup is the best. this will use twice the number of moving parts as the hexagon idea, but it is still very doable.

ive got to do some drawing and geometry now. ill decide which direction i want to go once i have everything mapped out.

Slug Toy
06-24-2006, 05:09 PM
just to mention. i did some math... and assuming a "bore" of 2 inches, and a "stroke" of 3 inches, to get around a 70cfm rate of flow, the pump only needs to operate at 30rpm (1 revolution every 2 seconds). so this can mean i can half the size and go with 60 rpm, or i can stay where it is. ideally, to save space i would want to make it smaller. maybe ill do a little math with a bore of 1.5 inches and a stroke of 2.5 inches.

06-24-2006, 05:15 PM
Ok, now that the valve thing is solved, I'll just sit back and watch as your design takes more shape... :D

who's got my popcorn??? :P :D

06-24-2006, 05:43 PM
one thing, you should ad a tube on the holes that make the link betwin the block and header, a tube there will ,make yore life a lot easyer, because it would alow for some air in that space after all, it will be the res of the setup!
what do you think ??

Slug Toy
06-24-2006, 05:49 PM
ideally i wouldnt want any air at all, because it may start making noise if it starts getting into the cylinders or the actual cooling loops. i could add on a separate section to deal with air though. im going to get through this hexagon vs W thing first.

Slug Toy
06-24-2006, 10:19 PM
hmmm, my geometry is melting down right now. its actually pretty hard transferring angles and lengths over to sketch up and have it work right. ive only just started using it though, so i dont know if theres a function to create defined angles and sides......

right now it looks like the W shape pump wins overall though. i just have to get a model of it done to show you guys what im thinking. im off to a friend's house now though, so its going to have to wait until tomorrow.

Slug Toy
06-26-2006, 10:35 PM
ok, after many hours of trial and error, ive got it for the most part.


so this is the W pump i was talking about. well, its actually the cylinder block of the pump. it took me so long just to get that figured out i decided to give up while i was ahead and before i screwed everything up.

the way i see it, its the most efficient design. it has the least number of moving parts possible while still having the smallest size possible.

so now all you need to do is imagine the valve system that i decided upon, and put it on this picture here, and you have a pretty much finished pump. ive just got to think about how the crankshaft, conrods, and pistons will look. it will probably be fairly basic though... no need to overthink anything.

thats it for now. its all ive got. im going to see if i can fix up the case design now. its a good design, but its not great now that ive had a chance to look at it for a while.

06-27-2006, 02:10 AM
hhhmm.... i love it, you did a great job
I was thinking the other day about the crankshaft, what are you gonna use for constructing it ???

Slug Toy
06-27-2006, 02:30 AM
i saw you were online and was expecting to see a post any minute. i guessed right.

well i think everything will be made of acrylic. this way nothing will be harder/stronger than anything else, and parts will wear evenly. ill probably use a combination of 1/4 inch acrylic sheet and two different size acrylic tubes (1.2 inch inside diameter, and half inch outside diameter). the half inch outside diameter tubing will be for the crankshaft, and so will the 1/4 sheet, and the 1/2 inch inside diameter will be for the conrod.

everything will slowly be updated from the looks of it.... the case will go through some changes, and ill add more detail to the pump model. words just dont work too well for designing purposes. im still not quite sure what direction i want to take the case in... i dont like deloreans, and its looking kind of like one, so that has to change. all i know at the moment is that the redesign needs to accomodate the pump now (the original idea didnt do that).

im going to have to do some more math about flow rates too, because the 70cfm at 30rpm was assuming all six cylinders were being used. im only using one cylinder per loop (one cylinder at 30rpm puts out 11.7cfm), so i need to see if i need to change dimensions or speeds or both (i dont really want to start adding cylinders or else ill end up with some sort of monster). actually, to tell you the truth, i dont even know what kind of flow rate is good for a water pump.

i should mention now that im kind of writing this as i think of it. and speaking of that, if i need to add cylinders, ill switch to a radial design like on old propeller planes. maybe do 12 cylinders, and then ill put the pump unit outside the case on the right hand side so you can watch it go.

now my heads going a mile a minute. i need to figure this out before i drive myself crazy with questions.

06-27-2006, 03:23 AM
you're right you should slow down a bit, take a step back and then...... jump in again :D.
About the cilinders: if you decide you want more and make a redial that will make building a crankshaft much more easy, but i dont personaly like that setup because half of the pistons are inverted, most valves are gravitational so that would be one more pain in the a$$.
I dont see nonthing wrong with the flow, because you dont have a centriugal pump, with a piston pump brunt, i think it will be ok, the only alternative i can find (and found i did 2 year ago) is to buy a v8 bug block :D
just a joke
<edit> I wanted to ask you this for a while:what time is it at youre place, in here is 10:25 in the morning

Slug Toy
06-27-2006, 03:50 AM
well right now its quarter to 1 in the morning over here.

if you decide you want more and make a redial that will make building a crankshaft much more easy

that was what drew me to the hexagonal design... the simplicity of the crankshaft (i have a feeling the crankshaft is going to give me quite a bit of trouble no matter what though). for more than 6 cylinders, the radial approach is the best idea, but im right on the border right now.

most valves are gravitational so that would be one more pain in the a$$

i think ill use some of those rubber valves that you find in air pumps and things like that. they are suction based, so gravity isnt a problem, especially when there is water on both sides of the valve to keep pressure fairly equal.

im right in the middle of checking out some specs on normal centrifugal pumps to see what kind of flow rates are good. after that, bed time. ill get back on here tomorrow after school.

Slug Toy
06-27-2006, 04:02 AM
yikes, one last rather startling thing before i call it a night.

i was just checking some of danger dens pumps. they are rated a 1000 liters an hour on their maximum setting. this works out to about 16.7 liters per minute.

i did some math, and assuming one cylinder in my pump does 11.7 cubic feet per minute at 30rpm, that works out to about 316 liters per minute. thats roughly 19 times what is needed.

looks like i CAN do some changes to the size after all.

06-27-2006, 04:03 AM
well what can i say....... take a big nap
yeahh thoes valves will work ok i think
ps: the crank is scary, i know

06-27-2006, 04:06 AM
i'm out! gotta go to power lifting, body building thingy caled gym:( :(
<edit> didn't get to see the last port you made.... damn you're way over the mark, i agree you can make some dimension changes, or you make a total overkill and leave it as it is :D

06-27-2006, 04:08 AM
looking really sweet!!! will keep watching...

and by the way, let me imagine a mile ahead like you did :P
If you're going for the radial thing, why not make the whole case-design a plane... might look sweet...

Slug Toy
06-27-2006, 08:00 PM
well i knew 319 liters per minute was too good to be true. damn me and my late night figuring. i think i was way off.


so this should help visualize things. that picture represents dimensions of a single cylinder.

the math is as follows:

volume of the cylinder equals pi R squared times height, and R equals half the diameter. so the are of the top face of the cylinder is 3.14159265358979 x 2.54cm x 2.54cm, which equals 20.268299163899889164 square centimeters (note that ive decided to convert to the metric system.... just because i like it better). the area times the height equals 20.268299163899889164 x 7.62cm, which is 154.44443962891715542968 cubic centimeters, or millileters. 1 cubic cm equals 1 milliliter.

so ideally one cylinder will pump 154.4ml per stroke (0.1544 liters). then over 30 strokes (the 30rpm) this equals about 4.63 liters per minute. this turns out to be about a quarter of what i need.

i cant make the cylinder bigger because thats just getting too large. the only thing i can do is increase the number of cylinders and speed. i dont want to go too fast, so im limiting the rpm to 60 at most. this doubles the flow rate to about 9.26 liters per minute, but its still not really enough. i may need up to 12 cylinders after looking at the PROPER figures now. looks like the radial design is the way to go after all.

god, only i can disappoint myself like this. its a good thing i know not to trust my first reactions and wait a day. that also probably why most of my designing turns out to be retarded.

06-27-2006, 08:05 PM
hhhhmm(twich) need 5 minutes to think its 3:00AM in here

06-27-2006, 08:13 PM
ok i'm alive (twich)
first of: I subscribed to youre thread, and you got 5 stars from me:D
there are 2 ways to get a biger flow:
1) diameter
2) a longer travel

and there is one more(twich)
you dont need to have a flat piston-head you can make it convex, like an U shape, not that extreme but you get my point

Slug Toy
06-27-2006, 09:45 PM
so lets see here.

1) diameter

that wont work because anything over a 2 inch diameter is too big to fit in a case. ive already allowed for a 12 inch width on the case i designed.

2) a longer travel

same problem here, at most i could increase it by a quarter inch, but no more

you dont need to have a flat piston-head you can make it convex, like an U shape, not that extreme but you get my point

in theory, this is a good idea. in practice, this only works with engines because it increases the volume that is combusting. for a pump, the output is always a function of the bore and the stroke and no matter what you do to the piston shape or the cylinder head, the bore and stroke are still the same, and the output is still the same.

trust me on this one..... this time anyways.... i need more cylinders.

06-28-2006, 04:36 AM
you're right about the piston-head(that was 3:00 AM thinking), it will just leave some water in the piston,
about the travel, a quarter inch is like 2,45/4=0.6cm hhmmm well it is better then nothing

last night i did some thinking (i didn't go to bed couldn't sleep) you could try a double radial i dont know the english word, my grandfather was a flight mecanic, thay had this kind of engines , its a good design becouse it wont enlarge the diameter, and you get 2 active cilinders instead of one thus double the flow
<edit> (twich) it just hit my head: you could get a radial 12 damn.... motor porn

06-28-2006, 05:56 AM
you could get a radial 12

I think that would look sweet, even when you place it on the outside of the case..
I'm beginning to like the idea more and more... Imagine seeing al the moving part and all :eek:

hope it'll work in the end

06-28-2006, 05:59 AM
that's what it is

Slug Toy
06-28-2006, 05:34 PM
I think that would look sweet, even when you place it on the outside of the case..
I'm beginning to like the idea more and more... Imagine seeing al the moving part and all

im liking the idea more and more too. its a strong possibility that ill go with a 12 radial. im already designing.

that's what it is

if you're into that sort of thing i suppose.... but i dont want to hear about it.

try a double radial

ive already passed by that. two six piston radials together would be interesting, but it adds complexity to the crankshaft. i think the 12 radial is the best option now.

06-28-2006, 05:39 PM
the porn was i joke man you know in stead oh girls you get a V12 (my weat dream LOL)

so its a 12 radial, when you make the designs could put a hdd or something like that so i can get a fell for its scale

Slug Toy
06-28-2006, 07:47 PM
ya i know it was a joke... i just dont want to know anymore than that....

so i got the picture done... sorta. talk about a hassle getting dimensions right. everything was fighting me through this.


so i put in some numbers again, for the things that arent very obvious:

1. this will be the top block that will also house the cylinder intakes. its going to be part of the reservoir too.

2. the cylinder outputs. so there will be pipes on the outside that you can maybe watch air bubbles pass through.

3. thats what a hard drive would look like compared to the pump. you can see its going to be big (i figure about 15 inches in diameter).

one thing i was thinking about while looking at what i designed is water flow inside the top block. seeming as all the pistons will be connected to the same section of the crankshaft, they will be going up and down like a stadium full of people doing the wave. this may make an interesting current inside the block, and it may be a good idea to put the main inputs on an angle so its doesnt cause any turbulence.

ill figure the rest of this out later. right now im kind of dumping memory resources in my head... i just had a geology midterm today.

so ive got to take a break and make dinner now. if you have any questions, now is the time to ask, and ill get back on here ASAP (probably an hour or two).

06-29-2006, 06:12 AM
you my man are a genius
one thing is scraping my mind: the pistons design, i'm thinking at sealing method with minimal drag, because drag its starting to be a pain with 12 cilinders, i'm thinking 2 or 3 ruber rings/piston, and using oil-water emulsion,like one part oil 2 parts water

Canadian Eh?
06-29-2006, 09:04 AM
the pic kinda looks like a ferris wheel

06-29-2006, 04:54 PM
first the fungus now this.... LOL you got a funny way of looking at pics, do you even read the thread, or just trust you're instinct (lol)

Slug Toy
06-29-2006, 05:46 PM
i'm thinking at sealing method with minimal drag

ive been thinking about this too. i personally think that embedding a ring of clear silicone on each piston will work good enough. itll end up a sort of rubbery sealing, and that is probably the best when dealing with liquids. oil is a maybe, but im starting to think about thermal capacities now. i dont think oil is very good at carrying heat. what would be interesting is graphite, water, and an anti-fungal solution mixed together. graphite has something like 16x the thermal conductivity that water does, and as you probably know, its a good lubricant when finely powdered.... and best of all i just need to go buy a bunch of pencil lead to do it. i could also go buy some of that really fine copper powder that you add to paint to give a metallic look... but copper is heavy and would probably start pooling somewhere and gum the whole thing up. at least graphite wont do that as easily.

another idea would be alcohol... whether it be rubbing alcohol or booze. ethanol (the booze alcohol) evapourates at something like 78 degrees C, and may have a better cooling effect. i really dont know though, im just thinking right now.

the pic kinda looks like a ferris wheel

ya but it sure as hell wont act like one.

06-29-2006, 05:57 PM
well oil has a beter heat capacity then water, and it would help with the lubrication of the pistons and as i said earlier use an oil-water emulsion, the graphite is great at heat but in a short time would make youre cilinders black, it would be nice though to see how much graphite water can absorbe
BTW how is scool any more exams

Slug Toy
06-29-2006, 06:13 PM
school is good for now... yesterday was my last midterm. dont need to worry for a couple weeks (lab exam) and then i have finals in early august.

so i get most of august off and im going to give it my damnedest effort to NOT get thrown back into work. electrical pre-apprenticing is total crap... the dust from the drywallers gave me nosebleeds everyday (still got them too) and the noise is too much. i think ill probably doing a lot of boating instead and working out... i do weight training too. modding too, of course... cant forget that. maybe ill actually get enough time to get some serious work done for once.

anyways... ya im looking into this oil vs water thing right now, and im looking at graphite again just to make sure ive got my numbers straight (knowing me they are probably so crooked you could kill yourself on them)...

ill let you know when and if i find anything that leads me to a decision about this.

06-29-2006, 06:19 PM
i'm doing some house work(water damage :mad: ) my self... it sucks, ouu and nomber checking is good:D
btw wanted to ask you this for some time take a loke at my project tell my what you think of it

06-29-2006, 06:20 PM
ouu and we can talk all night long, I just had that no sleep fealing LOL

Slug Toy
06-29-2006, 06:38 PM
i actually HAVE been following your project already. it looks like it took inspiration from a mac tool bock or something. the one thing that has me concerned is those blowers. it looks like they gather their effectiveness from laminar flows, and im just wondering if you intend to strap them on the sides without molding a smooth path for air to flow through. the best use ISNT to stick them on the side of a case and have the air passing by the walls at sharp angles (the laminar thing comes into play because air has a strange ability to cling to surfaces when moving).

i remember way back... two years ago... i designed pulse jet that was more like a hybrid scramjet, and the whole thing was based on laminar flow and pressure differentials. i had it down so accurately that i got it running from a standstill (most pulse jets need a leaf blower to get them started), it had an intake and exhaust (in normal pulse jets you have a U shaped tube that air does a back-and-forth thing inside) and it didnt even need any valves to keep air going one way. didnt even get hot either.... usually pusle jets are made of iron and they still get red hot. anyways... my point is that its a good idea to design with airflow in mind... you would not believe what a difference a simple curve will make instead of a right angle.

im sure we could talk all night. ive got tomorrow off school thanks to canada day on saturday (thats my birthday too) so ill probably be up late. the question is... will we run out of things to talk about.

Slug Toy
06-29-2006, 06:49 PM
wow, the verdict is already in on the liquid to use.

oils in general are horrible for conducting heat, but they are good at holding whatever heat they DO take. the best one was castor oil, but even then it was only about a quarter as good as water. alcohol isnt very good either.

so it looks like water is a good way to go. im looking at additives now (copper, aluminum, graphite, antifreeze). and ill make up my mind in a couple hours. dinner time for me.

06-29-2006, 06:51 PM
so its youre birthday...?? :D than HAPPY birthday(i want to be the first to say it)
damn...scramjet arrghhh, well its hard to tell how i'm going to put it in, but if you take a look at the datasheet i will explane you a lot easyer
<edit>ouu and if you have any thing on mind for my beloved project post in there.... dont wana mess up you're's

Slug Toy
06-29-2006, 10:31 PM
i think ill wait to see what you decide on doing, and then offer suggestions as they are needed.

well, i think i got a good additive that i can make at home to throw into the water system. ever heard of copper sulphate? CuSO4... this is slightly acidic, very toxic, wont react with copper water blocks, blue so it will look good, and its very easy to make providing you have the right starter chemicals. that solves a few problems... stops corrosion, kills all life in the water, and gives colour. then i can just add a surfactant if i want. ill just have to be careful and make sure the water system is good and closed, because copper sulphate will crystallize as water evapourates, and that could cause some damage if it crystallizes in the pump or on a waterblock or the radiator. the crystals would make for an interesting effect in the reservoir though.

i cant remember if i have the right chemicals to make the stuff, but i think it works with bleach and copper metal... you just get something like copper hypochlorite or maybe chloride. im going to check that out tomorrow, do some experiments to see what works. i could try aluminum too, because that would plate the inside of everything with aluminum which is better at dissipating heat.

so i think i might be going ot a friend's house tonight (if i can get through when his phone ISNT busy). ill post an update on progress tomorrow when ive crystallized some copper.

06-29-2006, 10:41 PM
copper sulphate?! wait a sec.....(going in the shed) ..................... victory! I have it :D:D:D in cristal form like small flakes(about half a kilo, its a lot), dad says thats the "****" (degree in chemistry) so thats the ****, to bad i'm on the other side of the earth, if you can finde a way to ship it i'l give it to you

Slug Toy
06-30-2006, 09:40 PM
well the bleach works, i can get some copper hypochlorite happening. just for the heck of it... i DID find out that mixing bleach with acetone will make chloroform. i wouldnt suggest trying it because it gets very hot, and it also makes you very dizzy just standing near it when its forming.

and now back to designing.

07-01-2006, 03:39 AM
hhhmm chloroform... now you can glue youre plexi with no extra cash spent on glue:D

so have "YOU"(fixed :D) decided what are you gonna put in the water

Slug Toy
07-01-2006, 05:12 AM
hhhmm chloroform... now you can glue youre plexi with no extra cash spent on glue

haha, that might not be the best of ideas, even for my standards. just in case you think chloroform is a glue... it isnt. its more like an anaesthetic. you breathe it in, and you pass out. not a good dea to be using it for glue.

so have decided what are you gonna put in the water

i think theres a critical YOU missing in there. if this is a question, the answer is yes. if its a statement, well the answer is still yes.

so the plan right now is to revamp the case design, and then ill figure out a way to design a better model of the pump (it would help if i could make dodecagon.... oh crap... one of those 12 sided polygons to start as a base so i dont have to go through all the measurement issues). i think ill do this, or some of it anyways, tomorrow seeming as i dont have anything else to do.

07-01-2006, 03:27 PM
sorry for the "you" i was after my sleep

redesign you say.... i have been thinking for this from the start: do you think it would be a good idea to make the cilinders removable so you can change the worn-out ones

Slug Toy
07-01-2006, 06:01 PM
do you think it would be a good idea to make the cilinders removable

interesting proposition. i hadnt thought of that. a modular design would be a good idea for something so complex. i have an idea for that now though. if i can design this right, i may be able to just slide the cylinders in, and twist-lock them kind of like in a jar of salsa. i would probably have to make the top block in two sections that can be screwed together to make that happen, and im not sure what would happen with the pistons... havent gotten that far yet.

actually, that modular design would fit right in with the case too.... seeming as the waterwall, case air intake, and case air outlet are removable.

you just gave me a new rush of creativity.

07-01-2006, 06:04 PM
(victory dance)
now you go to my thread and give one(i'm in big need of one)
<Edit> can i PM you

Slug Toy
07-01-2006, 06:17 PM
now you go to my thread and give one(i'm in big need of one)

ill see what i think of

<Edit> can i PM you

go for it.

07-02-2006, 02:26 PM
so... any progres?

Slug Toy
07-02-2006, 04:35 PM
funny you should mention that... because YES. i have a cleaner pump model for you.


i think ive also got quite a smart method to be able to replace the cylinders.

the top block will be one solid ring with holes drilled into it for the cylinders, there will also be a little piece of acrylic at 90 degrees to this hole, with a tooth on it. the cylinders will have a groove that the tooth will fit into, and then you can just twist the cylinder to lock it in.

i figured that much out and then said to myself.... theres no room to get the pistons in after that. well actually there is, providing you go in a certain order. before you even think about putting the cylinders into the top block, slide them over the pistons, and down as far as possible on the conrods. then place the whole thing inside the top block, and you can then twist each cylinder in no problem.

so in theory, that should be simple to do. in practice, there may not be enough room to actually fit all the cylinders on the piston before hand. in that case, well i have to cut the top block in half and do it the hard way.

right now, none of the dimensions have changed... still probably about 15 inches in diameter. i also tried to show my idea of having multiple input in the top block to get a circular current going that follows the piston action, but sketchup wouldnt let me. lets just say the inputs will be at about 60 degrees to get a really pronounced current going.

<EDIT> got chores to do today, so this is it for a few hours. ill get on the case though.... in time.

07-02-2006, 04:39 PM
oohhhh hel yeh
now let me edit:D so i can say something smart
<edit>:d there could be a problem with sealing the cilinders, a part from that.... i dont see no space problem, the thing that comes to my mind looking at the sketch is that you would have to use long travle on the pistons, or is it just me?

Slug Toy
07-02-2006, 06:26 PM
my god, too hot for chores right now....

yes, i may need to use a longer piston... which would mean enlarging the diameter, and then the cylinders wouldnt fit nicely, there would be a larger gap.

as for sealing the cylinders, ill probably put a bit of clear silicone on to act as the seal... just like for the pistons.

looks like math comes in again... ill do some drawing to see if there will be an issue with the assembly method, and if so, well then theres another redesign to do. for now though.... the case REALLY needs an update. its design is still meant for the simple in line 6 cylinder pump....

07-02-2006, 06:40 PM
Too hot.... tell me about it :(
you're right about the case, the thing you should try to do is to have the pump visible

oftopic: tomorrow the blower guy should send me my "toys" so i should have them by the next day
(just thought you would be happy for me :D)
<EDIT> hey I just noticed I got my new rank :D
funny because my rig is :DD

07-03-2006, 05:51 PM
any progres Slug ?!

Slug Toy
07-03-2006, 06:20 PM
not yet.... only about half way there on the case. im just seeing what looks good. ive got the pump meshed with the waterwall, and i just finished the disc drive and case air exhaust designs.

dinner is soon, so expect something anywhere between now and 4 hours from now.

Slug Toy
07-03-2006, 11:48 PM
finally, an hour and a half late... im done. no time to lose.



theres a couple to gawk at for a minute.


heres a nice picture of the pump with the waterwall. the crankshaft is now in there, and ive added in some lines to approximate how the pistons will be positioned.


heres one of the case air exhaust. kind of looks like a space ship cockpit. ive tried to carry a circular theme to as much as i can seeming as the radial pump will be a focal point and it is more or less a circular shape.


heres a picture of the disc drive in the foreground and the case air exhaust in he background. im now DAMN sure that one of my drives are on the fritz, so i have a toy to play with so i can practive modding drives.


and the last one... the case air intake. ive switched things up with it too in order to keep with a circular theme. nice big "window" to see a bunch of nothing (maybe some of the air cleaning stuff, i dont know yet). i dont really know if there will be a window to see the actual inside of the case.... i may or may not design this intake will acrylic in mind. right now, im just concered with having enough time to clean the air properly.

so thats what i have now. i think its better than the first itteration, but ill leave it for a day or so and take another look at it. there may be another redesign.... circular theme is staying no matter what i do.

07-04-2006, 01:43 AM
great just great
i see that you should be ok with the pushrods they clear the cilinder,i see the crank, did i understud right... you gonna integrate a filter unit,
i like the style of the air intakes
Q: what acrylic are you gonna use for the pump and for the blue parts

Slug Toy
07-04-2006, 02:25 AM
did i understud right... you gonna integrate a filter unit

yep. there will be an air filter in the intake (thats why the intake is so large, to compensate for the resitance passing through the paper/cloth/foam/mesh). i just might do a water filter too, although thats getting a little excessive, its a closed loop so nothing should be getting in or out.

what acrylic are you gonna use for the pump and for the blue parts

not too sure yet. it depends on a couple factors

1. what i can get a hold of (theres a place that specializes in acrylics and all sorts of polycarbonates over by my dads work)

2. what the colours are. i need to go have a look. i think the case is going to be a dark colour, probably similar to what the model colour is, and the acrylic just has to look good with a dark gray. maybe blue, maybe green, maybe clear with lighting. maybe some etching... now that im reasonably satisfied with the design, i need to start thinking about this stuff.

just another thought... as i was writing this and looking back at the pictures. the front intake that will be for the watercooling.... that has to change.... it doesnt follow the circular pattern, and looks out of place.

07-04-2006, 04:21 AM
wow, really like it, comming together slowly but steadily. I'd really like to see how this works out! do you have some kind of deadline? or are you just trying to get it perfect?
keep up the good work!

Slug Toy
07-04-2006, 04:37 AM
perfection is the name of the game right now. i WAS interested in maximan's little contest, but if the deadline is august 14.... that wont happen.

i may enter a contest, but it wont be one that dictates my schedule. i wont rush anything for the sake of competition... id rather wait to win three months later than come in second now.

at the moment, the design phase seems to be winding down. everything has been thought of. i cant really start this until august though, after my final exams. maybe gather some materials and get some blueprints done up.... possibly even a LITTLE bit of work between now and then, but school is #1 for now.

so im going to fix that one little front intake thing, and then that is it for now.... key phrase being "for now" because things change. i can always help out gearhead if i need something to occupy myself.

07-04-2006, 04:43 AM
... i can always help out gearhead if i need something to occupy myself.
and that he did

ouu that give me a fuzzy fealing :D :D

you are right about the front it does look out of line
what are you going to put behind it
are you goona put the rad

Slug Toy
07-04-2006, 04:50 AM
what are you going to put behind it
are you goona put the rad

ah, nope... no radiator in the front. the radiator is the waterwall... thats why i call it the waterwall, all the cooling happens there, and convection will be a player (hot water in the top, cold out the bottom because cold water sinks).

the front is just where the air goes in, and works its way over to the radiator. if you need, ill see if i can whip up a model of the radiator i have in mind, and put it in the case to show you. it wouldnt take too long. might as well do that tonight too, i gotta be up in 6 hours, and i just had an EXHILARATING conversation so im in no mood to sleep.

07-04-2006, 04:58 AM
you do that

EXHILARATING conversation
is that in good or bad way
BTW: i have something for you, check my log

Slug Toy
07-04-2006, 05:27 AM
alright, new intake for the water cooling air supply.


the picture says enough about itself... i dont think i need to add anything. just admire....

oh, yes... exhilarating in a good way right now... possible bad effects on wednesday... we'll see.

07-04-2006, 05:30 AM
you sure got the admire part right
i like the look of it and with all that space for the filter you aint gonna have no flow problems

Slug Toy
07-04-2006, 06:01 AM
wow, i think im getting fairly good at sketch up now... im already done the radiator layout.


so you can see now where the radiator will be. of course... the radiator will be a little more complex than that, but i dont want to be here ALL night modelling.

like i said, hot water in the top, cold water out the bottom. simple... hopefully.

<EDIT> done for the night. i just cant handle the all nighters anymore. gotta be fresh for school....

07-07-2006, 02:01 PM
now i get the full picture
dude what's going on i have been gon for 3 days, i dont see anything new ,are you ok?:(

Slug Toy
07-07-2006, 07:31 PM
oh ya, well youve already seen what ive gotten myself into. this contest is now my baby i guess.

07-08-2006, 03:59 AM
.....this contest is now my baby i guess.

so... are you still doing the pump?? :(

Slug Toy
07-08-2006, 02:34 PM
the pump design is pretty much 100% now. im still doing it, but i dont need to design any more i think. work will start after my exams finish in august, just like i was planning. between now and then i need to go find a case to tear apart....

07-08-2006, 03:47 PM
how about making one :D you're self :D
a lot more flexible
can you send the full sketch of the complet design :D

Slug Toy
07-08-2006, 04:04 PM
how about making one you're self

well i tried that with the zanzibar thing... didnt work too well to say the least. ive found a couple cases that are pretty much perfect anyways.

can you send the full sketch of the complet design

thank god i kept your email address. coming right up.

07-09-2006, 03:57 AM
there is one thing that i cant check of the list
how are you gonna pover the pump
you could use a servo like me a have one the goes at 60rpm high torque
cant stop it by hand

Slug Toy
07-09-2006, 04:49 AM
ive been wondering about that too. im sure any medium size 12 volt motor with a good gear-down would work. i just have to find one. ive got time though.... ill figure it out.

im sure i will need some good torque. moving 12 cylinders probably wont be that easy.

07-12-2006, 07:07 PM
you do realize that that you shatered the record for the bigest idea zone tread

Slug Toy
07-12-2006, 09:21 PM
really? well, i think a gold medal is in order. or maybe at least a sandwich. no? how about some spare change? no? ok, how about a slap in the face then?

i still foresee this thread growing even larger. im sure theres still stuff left to squabble about yet.

07-13-2006, 03:15 AM
did you do any more sketching

Slug Toy
07-14-2006, 02:03 AM
nothing new to report right now.

im actually in the process of recoiling in horror. my actions in general over the past couple weeks have been rather out of place... and i think i have to step back for a minute and ask "okay, what the hell is going on here?"

dont worry though, everythings fine. i just have to organize and schedule things... something ive never had to do before. the contest is really whats doing it. im firing off an unbelievable number of emails a day now... and chatting with people. lots of talk and mental anguish for not a lot accomplished so far... still no sponsors.

anyways... yes there will be more models. im probably going to start thinking about waterblocks and a radiator design now. lots of fun, more applied fluid dynamics and thermodynamics. cross flow and laminar flow, heat flow rates... and headaches.

07-14-2006, 02:37 AM
... still no sponsors

tell me about it, i've noticed a general thing: you talk wwith the guy and wham when you say the magic word (sponsor) silence

... and headaches

that part I know so well

...i have to step back...
well i think you could(should) take a break

Slug Toy
07-18-2006, 01:57 AM
well i HAVE taken a little time off just to sit back. wow... the things you can accomplish in daily life when you arent consumed by computer designs. i think im getting a new bike!

so anyways, back to business so to speak. i think ill work on waterblock stuff now. none of this danger den crap... i dont go that way. ive got me some 2" wide, .25" thick copper flatbar, and i intend to use it (once i figure out how to convert my drill press to a milling machine). for now, the first stage is designing though. no sense in doing this if i have no idea what the end result should be.

ill start work on a model tomorrow after school. hopefully it wont take too long.

on another note... the contest thread has been closed... i dont know who did it, dont care either. not that its important or anything... it can kind of fade away for the time being. i just thought id aknowledge the fact that someone maybe doesnt think too kindly of the direction im taking it.

07-18-2006, 02:26 AM
I closed the thread because I was banned and didn't want people doing MY job.

Slug Toy
07-18-2006, 03:31 AM
I closed the thread because I was banned and didn't want people doing MY job.

state your intentions then. dont just close the thread. from what i understand, you have good contact with butcher... you could have sent along a message through him saying not to touch anything. if im not mistaken... you're also going away soon... so it was sort of a collective decision that someone else needed to step in and get things back on track.

if you want control of the contest again, ill gladly give it up, i dont particularly LIKE the amount of trouble im going through to find sponsors, especially when i dont get any sort of response. i HAVE sunk a lot of time into it though, so i admit that ill be bummed out if you DO want it. maybe you have some sources you could draw on for better prizes though (ive been getting the general message that stickers might not be the most attractive).

so, by all means, take charge again... that leaves me more time to worry about my mod. no matter what happens... me and scotty are trying to get a logo done, so that will be soon(ish), and ill still stay as a judge if im needed.

now... getting back to the waterblock. maybe i wont finish tomorrow after all. i got a jump on it tonight, and the design i have in mind is a LOT of work. youll see what i mean... eventually.

<EDIT> after having thought about the contest a little more, ill give this advice for you maximan. dont act on impulses and just do things like close a thread. people have to know what you're planning, or else you wont get anyone entering, or volunteering to be a judge, or offering prizes.

dont take this as an attack. i just found out very quickly that everything has to be laid out clearly and definitively, and in most cases more than once. in my opinion, closing that thread wasnt a good move. i get the feeling it may have just buggered things up a bit. to say the least it kind of buggered me up because now i dont know where i stand in all this again, and a lot of work may end up getting nullified or redone for no reason now.

07-18-2006, 07:36 AM
now this aint right, you work youre ass off for this an he closes the thread.... not right

to get back to business, i realy wanna see that waterblock design(are you in that watercolling contest?)

Slug Toy
07-18-2006, 04:59 PM
now this aint right, you work youre ass off for this an he closes the thread.... not right

ya im a little put off by that... it wasnt a very nice thing to do. it could mean a lot of wasted time on my part... but in all fairness, it was his idea in the first place, and he has the power apparently.

i have a couple tricks up my sleeve though, so dont lose hope on this yet.

to get back to business, i realy wanna see that waterblock design(are you in that watercolling contest?)

no i dont think ill do that watercooling contest. i decided that i dont half-ass things, and i didnt really like the idea of being bound to ghetto style stuff. ill wait for another contest... one where i can exercise my need to rather excessive.

im working on this model now. fingers crossed, maybe tonight... maybe not.

07-18-2006, 06:15 PM
must see ..resist, must resist must see, must

Slug Toy
07-18-2006, 06:46 PM
alright alright. you get it your way. i got through most of it.... and found out that its going to take a looooooooong time, so im leaving it like it is now. PICTURES!!!



so those are two views of it. reasonably simple design, although i bet its going to be a bugger to actually make.


and heres the secret to getting good cooling. the combination of the ridges and holes everywhere should give a pretty large surface area. i may deviate from the design eventually, but all my knowledge is telling me i probably wont improve on what i have too much. the wheels are still turning though... constantly.

so ya, you can imagine how retardedly long it would take to make all those holes in such a confined space... not worth the effort in my opinion when you can get your point across with just a small example.

lots of fun ahead still.

07-18-2006, 07:13 PM
Hey man nice block designs, i was looking to get some custom milled blocks myself. Shame my dad no longer works at a machine shop! Missed the opertuninty by about a week.

I too didnt want to go down the standard dangerden route, overpriced crap for what it is really, a piece of machined copper at the end of the day with a channel milled out of it.

I started on some sketchup designs, basiclly a flat piece of copper with a zig-zag channel milled from one end to the other and an O-ring grove around the outside that would seal the water in when the matching half was screwed onto it (probally made from plex)

I would post them but they wernt finished and i cant do with half assed drawings :) good luck with you mod though, im all for custom work. Hope you get sponsored soon bud.


07-19-2006, 03:46 AM
hhhhhm.... i like it, it should work great, there's a lot of surface on it, do have some dimensions in mind for it ?

Slug Toy
07-19-2006, 06:39 PM
well my flatbar is 2 inches wide, so ill probably have the copper bit as a 2x2 square. the acrylic is another story since it has to have mounts and ports and all that.

i would expect it to be like one of those maze waterblocks from danger den... except better.

07-19-2006, 07:55 PM
i would expect it to be like one of those maze waterblocks from danger den... except better

looking forword to that

talking about size, i did some paper sketching with my dad today and the thing just jumped 50cm, its 50cm long, 50 , i made some estimations end it seems that i'm going to need like 7 or 8 meters of squer tubing

Slug Toy
07-19-2006, 08:49 PM
well 50cm is a good size... 19.28 inches if my scribbling is right. i dont see anything wrong with a box with those dimensions. my case is going go be about 20x20x10 inches... maybe bigger.

07-19-2006, 08:58 PM
... maybe bigger

ouu i know that so well:rolleyes:

07-21-2006, 06:32 PM
any progres or something

Slug Toy
07-21-2006, 07:16 PM
not a lot. ive been thinking about how to make the ports on the block work better, but i havent come up with anything to make a special note of.

the contest has got me wrapped up right now. i may actually be making some progress with sponsors.

07-25-2006, 06:52 PM
any thing new on the sponsor front

Slug Toy
07-29-2006, 06:06 PM
i totally missed this. its been a while since ive checked back here.

no progress on sponsors. im hitting more brick walls. there WAS some interest, and then they decided not to respond to my emails. i just love companies...

i HAVE been thinking about the waterblock though. after looking at it for a long time, and going through some notes about fluid dynamics, ive decided that i havent come up with the most efficient design yet. ive got some work to do. at this point im not even sure what a good idea would be, but that just takes time to solve.

ive also been working on that car.... you know about that already though. no progress there, but if there is any... i wont post it here, ill send a PM. unless people want to know about what crazy things i have going on in the automotive world too...

07-29-2006, 06:11 PM
you be sure to PM me with the car