first car.

i was wondering since we have some racers and car nuts in here if anyone can recommend a good starter car. the things i want are power and upgradable. when i say upgradeable i mean i want to mod the body and the engine later down the road for more power. it dosent matter weather its a muscle car or a tuner. i just want something nice to work with. so any recommendations on engines, types of cars to look for. also i dont want to spend a fortune.

thanks in advance guys.

also i know its my first car. i shouldn't want or need all of that, but if im gonna do something i wanna do it right the first time around.

Plenty of room inside and under the hood, reasonably safe, mechanically reliable, available in good shape for around a grand, acceptable stock power and nearly unlimited build-up/swap options, rear-wheel-drive, invisible to the cops, and nice enough that a potential date's folks will probably approve...

...what you want is a Volvo 740/940 Turbo.

I'm not joking, and I speak from experience. (A naturally-aspirated car is a good call, too - slow enough to keep you out of trouble - as is a 240 if you live somewhere where rust isn't an issue.) If you get a wagon, the back seat will fold flat so that you and someone else can sleep comfortably (if you're both under six-foot-two or so).

Of course, this is easiest in the Northeast or Pacific Northwest, where people bought 'em in the first place.

that looks like a pretty nice car. now if i can find one under 2 grand around my area. if i cant find that i was thinking maybe a eclipse.

I'm fond of the Nissan Maxima's. Performance scene is there. The 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gens can be had for cheap, and the VG/VE engines are tanks. 200K on the odometer is just getting broken in... They are like Cummins redheaded stepchild, or something. :p

What are you looking for though? Car, truck? FWD, RWD? Compact, Sedan?

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Originally Posted by altec

I'm fond of the Nissan Maxima's. Performance scene is there. The 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gens can be had for cheap, and the VG/VE engines are tanks. 200K on the odometer is just getting broken in... They are like Cummins redheaded stepchild, or something. :p

What are you looking for though? Car, truck? FWD, RWD? Compact, Sedan?

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deffinatly car as for the wheel drive i have no idea. i was going to get a nova, camero, older mucle car but cant afford that right now so a tuner is the next best thing.

Honestly, for a first car you really should be looking at something simple, that will get you around, and start in the morning without worry. And the ever important mileage.

There is a million choices out there. I suggest hunting around to see what you can find in your area, and researching the specific cars.

For 2k your options are limited, and considering things like tags, insurance, and gas play a role you are limited. A maxima might be the car for you. I have a 89 myself. They have 3.0 v6, and have a ton of power options. And being a higher end Nissan you have a nice car that you can cram 5 people into.

I believe in having the daily beater, and the toy. I am building my toy truck, and am going to tag the maxima for my daily. Better to start with the beater, and save for the toy then the other way around.

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Originally Posted by blaze15301

first car

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Originally Posted by blaze15301

power

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what an excellent combination!

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Originally Posted by dr.walrus

what an excellent combination!

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the power will come over time.

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Originally Posted by blaze15301

the power will come over time.

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first car + power = big ass ticket... trust me, i speak from experience:facepalm:

i'd say look at a vw. the 2.0 engines are fun, not too powerfull, but fun. also they handle well. so much aftermarket you won't know where to start. they can be had pretty cheap. the downfall is when the electrical gremlins rear their ugly heads and when the oil light starts coming on at random. that signals the demise that is iminent.

of course you can't go wrong with a nice toyota corolla. also oodles of aftermarket suport for what ever fun level you can afford. you can pick up a geo prizm real real cheap and they are just corollas with different badges. so either one will provide you with major reliability.

now if you really want fun and a learning experience, you could look at the mk2 celica supras. they usually can be had from anywhere between 1500 to about 4 or 5 g's. rust is an issue with them though.

another good choice that would suit your need to get tickets very well is an early (92) lexus sc400. they can be had for as little as 1200 bucks. then you get toyota reliability along with a toyota v-8. the lexus sc300 is much more expensive though because everyone wants the 2jz engine in them.

if you want something to just get around and won't last very long, then a good used cavalier would work.

personally i'd stay away from civics. used ones go for way more than their actual worth and any that you could afford as a first car would be ragged to the point of being not much more than a 1:1 scale model.

don't forget to look at mazdas as well. there really is something to their zoom-zoom marketing. depending on model, they can be really fun to drive.

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Originally Posted by xr4man

i'd say look at a vw. the 2.0 engines are fun, not too powerfull, but fun. also they handle well. so much aftermarket you won't know where to start. they can be had pretty cheap. the downfall is when the electrical gremlins rear their ugly heads and when the oil light starts coming on at random. that signals the demise that is iminent.

of course you can't go wrong with a nice toyota corolla. also oodles of aftermarket suport for what ever fun level you can afford. you can pick up a geo prizm real real cheap and they are just corollas with different badges. so either one will provide you with major reliability.

now if you really want fun and a learning experience, you could look at the mk2 celica supras. they usually can be had from anywhere between 1500 to about 4 or 5 g's. rust is an issue with them though.

another good choice that would suit your need to get tickets very well is an early (92) lexus sc400. they can be had for as little as 1200 bucks. then you get toyota reliability along with a toyota v-8. the lexus sc300 is much more expensive though because everyone wants the 2jz engine in them.

if you want something to just get around and won't last very long, then a good used cavalier would work.

personally i'd stay away from civics. used ones go for way more than their actual worth and any that you could afford as a first car would be ragged to the point of being not much more than a 1:1 scale model.

don't forget to look at mazdas as well. there really is something to their zoom-zoom marketing. depending on model, they can be really fun to drive.

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im not really trying to get a ticket. i just want a car that i can customize and mod. i know cavaliers are ****. we have had 3 in the past 5 years. i was looking at the vw

We drive a '00 Sunfire.

Keep up with the maintenance (which there isn't too much of), it almost combines a family car and a luxury car.

a sunfire is a cavalier.

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im not really trying to get a ticket.

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i'm sure. i was just joking about that.

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Originally Posted by xr4man

i'm sure. i was just joking about that.

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yeah i know. i was just clarifying for other people as well becuase i know people probably think i want a fast car and ill be irresponsible and all that. i mean it is a good judgment based on first time drivers and most teenagers.

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Originally Posted by blaze15301

also i dont want to spend a fortune.

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Well then muscle cars are out. Even if you don't spend a lot on the initial car, gas will cost you a fortune. :P

Where do you live? If there's a lot of snow, I would definitely go FWD or AWD. Otherwise, personally I would go RWD. That is one of the few things I would do differently with my car, looking back.

Aside from that, pay serious attention to the weight of the car. You can get a lot more performance out of, say, 100HP in a 2000lb car than in a 2500lb car. Plus, you'll get a lot better mileage.

Overall, I would say look for a early-or-mid-90's Japanese or continental European (sorry, UK) sedan, hatchback, or station wagon. From my experience, in the US similarly spec'd Japanese cars tend to be cheaper. During that period you start to get the engine improvements that started giving a lot better efficiency, but you get out of all the weight that they started piling on later. Get airbags and ABS if you can, for insurance, if not just safety, purposes.

I'll put another vote of confidence in for Mazda. My 96 Protege is far from a performance car (4-door, <100HP), but when it's in good health I can pull some relatively pretty nice performance out of it. :D

Oh, and get a manual transmission. Not only are they more fun, you'll get better performance and better mileage. If you don't know how to drive one yet, learn. You'll thank me later. ;)

..oh, and get a motorcycle. :whistler:

I love the vw 2.0 ask me why...

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Originally Posted by FuzzyPlushroom

Plenty of room inside and under the hood, reasonably safe, mechanically reliable, available in good shape for around a grand, acceptable stock power and nearly unlimited build-up/swap options, rear-wheel-drive, invisible to the cops, and nice enough that a potential date's folks will probably approve...

...what you want is a Volvo 740/940 Turbo.

I'm not joking, and I speak from experience. (A naturally-aspirated car is a good call, too - slow enough to keep you out of trouble - as is a 240 if you live somewhere where rust isn't an issue.) If you get a wagon, the back seat will fold flat so that you and someone else can sleep comfortably (if you're both under six-foot-two or so).

Of course, this is easiest in the Northeast or Pacific Northwest, where people bought 'em in the first place.

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Beat me to it. lol I was gonna suggest the 240.

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Originally Posted by diluzio91

first car + power = big ass ticket... trust me, i speak from experience:facepalm:

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My first car was a '69 Nova. No tickets here. :D

Acura Legend
Toyota MR2
Mitsubishi Mirage
Old school BMW's

In high school you'll probably want to go with a 4 door. I wouldn't throw any money into your first car... a sub-2000 dollar vehicle isn't the platform you want to turn into your money pit. Save your money for a down payment on a nice car come sr. year-ish.

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Originally Posted by BuzzKillington

My first car was a '69 Nova. No tickets here. :D

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because they couldnt catch you

Actually it was geared for 1/4 mile so it road comfortably at 70 and got close to redline around 100, though it got there damn fast.

i can't believe i forgot to mention subaru. older imprezzas are cheap. and subaru is a close second to toyota in reliability. BUT, subaru puts items that may break right on top of the motor, so you can save a lot in labor costs if you need the alternator replaced or something. or you save a lot in personal time if you do it yourself.

btw, my first two cars were both supras. i owned the first one three times.

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Originally Posted by x88x

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Oh, and get a manual transmission. Not only are they more fun, you'll get better performance and better mileage. If you don't know how to drive one yet, learn. You'll thank me later. ;)

..oh, and get a motorcycle. :whistler:

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yeah i plan on getting a bike sooner or later. i do want manual for that reason. but automatic is just as good.

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Originally Posted by blaze15301

i do want manual for that reason. but automatic is just as good.

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Nope. Not even close. 2011 cars with automatics are getting closer but anything older than 1-2 years get better perfomance and mileage with a manual. Also for the most part better durability if you're easy on the clutch.

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Originally Posted by msmrx57

Nope. Not even close. 2011 cars with automatics are getting closer but anything older than 1-2 years get better perfomance and mileage with a manual. Also for the most part better durability if you're easy on the clutch.

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/\These. With an automatic you have no control over what happens or when. With a manual, you can increase the power available to you at any given time by shifting the gear ratios around, you can squeeze more life out of the transmission if you're good to it (not necessarily gentle ;) ), and you can get better mileage by keeping your engine's RPMs in the most efficient ranges all the time. Plus it's just a lot more fun. :D

On a side note, I had a friend in high school who had a late-60's Mustang....with an automatic...heresy! I take solace in the fact that it was like that when she got it though. At least she wasn't the one who screwed it up.

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Originally Posted by x88x

/\These. With an automatic you have no control over what happens or when. With a manual, you can increase the power available to you at any given time by shifting the gear ratios around, you can squeeze more life out of the transmission if you're good to it (not necessarily gentle ;) ), and you can get better mileage by keeping your engine's RPMs in the most efficient ranges all the time. Plus it's just a lot more fun. :D

On a side note, I had a friend in high school who had a late-60's Mustang....with an automatic...heresy! I take solace in the fact that it was like that when she got it though. At least she wasn't the one who screwed it up.

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im just really worried about burning the clutch up. aren't hey expensive to replace?

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Originally Posted by blaze15301

im just really worried about burning the clutch up. aren't hey expensive to replace?

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They're a bit expensive, yeah. Not horribly so though, if you do the work yourself. Plus, if you do it yourself you'll learn a lot about your car since you have to practically take the whole thing apart to do it. :P That being said, as long as you treat it properly, learn how to shift well, etc, you shouldn't have any problems. I'm not exactly gentle with my clutch, and my car is just now starting to let me know that it's wearing (get a little 'thunk' if I let it out too fast while accelerating)....and I'm almost at 160,000 miles on, I'm pretty sure, the original clutch (at least, I've never replaced it, and I have no paperwork saying the previous owner did). And a little over 30,000 of those miles were me.

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Originally Posted by blaze15301

im just really worried about burning the clutch up. aren't hey expensive to replace?

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I wouldn't worry too much. I'm not the most coordinated person, and I learned to drive manual in a New Beetle turbo - I don't think any modern manual gearbox is weaker than a VW five-speed, and I didn't kill either the clutch (which was a bit wonky when Mum bought the car... 105,000 miles ago) or the transaxle. Flimsy (though precise) linkage, combined with a tendency to eat reverse, then third, then... Of course, the four-speed automatic used through the '90s is somehow worse.

VWs are fun, but if you don't get a good one with a stack of service records, the odds are fair that you'll regret it.

Hondas are solid choices, too - either manual or automatic gearboxes will stay together (aside from '00-'03ish automatics) but you need a manual to get anywhere quickly in most of 'em. Watch for rust on earlier cars, artificially inflated values on any of 'em, and don't be that guy who rices out his crapbox and annoys everyone on the block.

Oh, a Mazda would be a good bet as well. Maybe hunt down a '90s 626 with a five-speed and see how you like it. The Ford Contour/Mercury Mystique are in the same class and are decent as well, provided the one you're looking at is free of electrical gremlins. On those as well as the 626, you definitely want to avoid the failure-prone automatic, so if you decide you don't want to take on a stick shift yet, you may as well look elsewhere. The Protege is an enjoyable, and undervalued, econobox.

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Originally Posted by FuzzyPlushroom

The Protege is an enjoyable, and undervalued, econobox.

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Heheh, yup! I like mine. :D Nice and simple, surprisingly rugged, even if you...don't exactly care for it as well as you should for a while.. <_< >_> .. Light enough that you get good gas mileage (~40mpg when it's in good health, though atm with a wonky O2 sensor and an alignment issue with one of the wheels, it's more like 35-36 :( ), and just enough power that if you play the transmission right and rev the nuts off the engine, it's a god bit of fun. All in a rather boring-looking body, so cops don't look twice at it. There is definitely something to be said for a good, basic car...and mine is as basic as they made the Protege...even more so now that the A/C is blown. :P IIRC the 626 is basically the Protege with a bit more extra bits and a bigger engine. Same repair manual covers both. :P

Oh, something else I thought of. If you plan on doing any...shall we say, 'interesting' driving, try and get one with at least semi-bucket seats. Mine has nowhere near real bucket seats, but they're enough that they give me a nice amount of lateral support when such is needed. ...makes driving my dad's pickup with a bench seat bloody terrifying though...once you get used to not moving at all in a hard corner, it's hard to adjust to sliding half way across the seat if you're not careful. :P

EDIT:
Oh, and a lot of people will get freaked out if they're looking at a car with a manual transmission and no tach. Don't worry about it. The car I learned on had a tach, but the car I drove most for the first year or so after that, and my car too, both have manuals and neither has a tach. Personally, I've gotten so when I have one, I don't pay any attention to it any more; not having one forces you to develop a better feel for the vehicle.

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Originally Posted by Snowman

I love the vw 2.0 ask me why...

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i gotta ask why.

also x88x your car does look pretty cheap and it s a 4 cylinder so not a gas hog. what about upgradability?

if you're talking about the protoge for upgradeability, you may have to hunker down and do a little research. i don't think it was a popular car to upgrade, so there my not e a huge aftermarket for it. but all that means is you have to research and find what items from other mazdas will fit it. or fit with little modification.

otherwise EVERYTHING is upgradeable. it all has to do with how much money you have.

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Originally Posted by blaze15301

i gotta ask why.

also x88x your car does look pretty cheap and it s a 4 cylinder so not a gas hog. what about upgradability?

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the 8 valve 2.0 may not be the fastest boat in the water but it is darn near indestructable. My motor has been through a lot that a normal one wouldn't survive. One of the biggest pluses in my eyes for the VAG (volkswagen automotive group) cars is they are still using iron instead of aluminum. You can build and rebuild this motor all you want to and the only concerns really are the aluminum head. I am watching a project now where a guy is building off of a 6 cylinder and it is going to be putting down at least 200 whp at each wheel. They are fun little cars and most are mechanical tanks so to speak. I am currently looking for a mk3 jetta or golf:banana:

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Originally Posted by blaze15301

also x88x your car does look pretty cheap and it s a 4 cylinder so not a gas hog. what about upgradability?

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I've never really gotten into it, but there does exist a Protege tuning community. Just search for Mazda Protege tuning with your search engine of choice; some stuff should pop up. I remember a while ago finding an entire forum dedicated to tuning/modding/etc Protege's, but can't for the life of me remember where it was.

As far as 4-door sedans go, yeah, it's a great little car. Personally, though, if I were to do it again I would go for a hatchback. Largely though, because I have occasion to carry bulky cargo more often than I have occasion to carry passengers. One I've always loved the design of is the Honda Accord mk2 hatchback. Partially, I think, because it's what I learned to drive in (when I was 13.. :whistler: ), but I just think it offers a great compromise between a sedan and a hatchback (though the backseat probably isn't nearly as large as I remember it..). I probably wouldn't buy one anymore (gen2 was '81-'85), but I still like the design. :D

I miss slant-roofed hatchbacks. :( They seem to have died in the 80's in everything but a few sports cars. :( There is definitely something to be said for finding a happy compromise between style, aerodynamics, and practicality.

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Originally Posted by x88x

I've never really gotten into it, but there does exist a Protege tuning community. Just search for Mazda Protege tuning with your search engine of choice; some stuff should pop up. I remember a while ago finding an entire forum dedicated to tuning/modding/etc Protege's, but can't for the life of me remember where it was.

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man that mazda would explode if you went and tried to put some aftermarket equipment on it after running so long like that. especially if its got a ton of miles.

Cold air intake today, New intake EGR valve/Gasket/o2 sensors/TPS/MAFS tomorrow!

I'm a sucker for a quality station wagon myself

You can say "that station wagon is ghey" as its dustin' on your a@# like a wheat crop.

Other then the nasty looking wheel offset, that wagon looks nice.

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Originally Posted by diluzio91

first car + power = big ass ticket... trust me, i speak from experience:facepalm:

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haha, me to, and i don't even have much power (sunfire)

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Originally Posted by Snowman

I love the vw 2.0 ask me why...

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nice air horns, do they sound like a train? and are you running a system or is that the power wire from the alt?

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Originally Posted by Twigsoffury

man that mazda would explode if you went and tried to put some aftermarket equipment on it after running so long like that. especially if its got a ton of miles.

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lol. Quite possibly. It more fills the role of 'good dependable car that gets me where I want to go, looks ok doing it, and gives a bit of fun when I want it to'. I've never been one to pour money into my car...instead I pour money into my computer...which depreciates a lot faster... :whistler:

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Originally Posted by Twigsoffury

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Nice car, looks like some nice additions too...just one problem. ...those spoilers..I'm no aerodynamics expert, but I would be willing to bet money that the bottom one doesn't really do anything...and I wouldn't be surprised if the top one doesn't have much affect either. Take those off and it's a nice little car. :P

well i want to thank all you guys for your in put and ill still keep this open. i unfortunately wont be buying a car anytime soon because i just lost my job.

that sucks man, sorry to hear it.

Damn, sorry to hear that. Hope you find another one (assuming you're looking).

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Originally Posted by Spawn-Inc

nice air horns, do they sound like a train? and are you running a system or is that the power wire from the alt?

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No, they broke I am getting a deeper set of horns and finding somewhere else to mount them. That is the main fuse box that sits on top of the battery it loks like this

I am running a system but you can't see the wires because I am ninja like that. I actually have a full set of ground and power running the full length of the car, as well as the switch wire from just inside the firewall to the trunk. This car was by far the easiest I have ever wired (did it on my lunch break) and has great accoustics.

To the OP sorry about the job loss that always stinks.