first car.

[xr4man]

i can't believe i forgot to mention subaru. older imprezzas are cheap. and subaru is a close second to toyota in reliability. BUT, subaru puts items that may break right on top of the motor, so you can save a lot in labor costs if you need the alternator replaced or something. or you save a lot in personal time if you do it yourself.

btw, my first two cars were both supras. i owned the first one three times.

[blaze15301]

:
Oh, and get a manual transmission. Not only are they more fun, you'll get better performance and better mileage. If you don't know how to drive one yet, learn. You'll thank me later.

..oh, and get a motorcycle.

yeah i plan on getting a bike sooner or later. i do want manual for that reason. but automatic is just as good.

[msmrx57]

i do want manual for that reason. but automatic is just as good.

Nope. Not even close. 2011 cars with automatics are getting closer but anything older than 1-2 years get better perfomance and mileage with a manual. Also for the most part better durability if you're easy on the clutch.

[x88x]

Nope. Not even close. 2011 cars with automatics are getting closer but anything older than 1-2 years get better perfomance and mileage with a manual. Also for the most part better durability if you're easy on the clutch.

/\These. With an automatic you have no control over what happens or when. With a manual, you can increase the power available to you at any given time by shifting the gear ratios around, you can squeeze more life out of the transmission if you're good to it (not necessarily gentle ), and you can get better mileage by keeping your engine's RPMs in the most efficient ranges all the time. Plus it's just a lot more fun.

On a side note, I had a friend in high school who had a late-60's Mustang....with an automatic...heresy! I take solace in the fact that it was like that when she got it though. At least she wasn't the one who screwed it up.

[blaze15301]

/\These. With an automatic you have no control over what happens or when. With a manual, you can increase the power available to you at any given time by shifting the gear ratios around, you can squeeze more life out of the transmission if you're good to it (not necessarily gentle ), and you can get better mileage by keeping your engine's RPMs in the most efficient ranges all the time. Plus it's just a lot more fun.

On a side note, I had a friend in high school who had a late-60's Mustang....with an automatic...heresy! I take solace in the fact that it was like that when she got it though. At least she wasn't the one who screwed it up.

im just really worried about burning the clutch up. aren't hey expensive to replace?

[x88x]

im just really worried about burning the clutch up. aren't hey expensive to replace?

They're a bit expensive, yeah. Not horribly so though, if you do the work yourself. Plus, if you do it yourself you'll learn a lot about your car since you have to practically take the whole thing apart to do it. That being said, as long as you treat it properly, learn how to shift well, etc, you shouldn't have any problems. I'm not exactly gentle with my clutch, and my car is just now starting to let me know that it's wearing (get a little 'thunk' if I let it out too fast while accelerating)....and I'm almost at 160,000 miles on, I'm pretty sure, the original clutch (at least, I've never replaced it, and I have no paperwork saying the previous owner did). And a little over 30,000 of those miles were me.

[FuzzyPlushroom]

im just really worried about burning the clutch up. aren't hey expensive to replace?

I wouldn't worry too much. I'm not the most coordinated person, and I learned to drive manual in a New Beetle turbo - I don't think any modern manual gearbox is weaker than a VW five-speed, and I didn't kill either the clutch (which was a bit wonky when Mum bought the car... 105,000 miles ago) or the transaxle. Flimsy (though precise) linkage, combined with a tendency to eat reverse, then third, then... Of course, the four-speed automatic used through the '90s is somehow worse.

VWs are fun, but if you don't get a good one with a stack of service records, the odds are fair that you'll regret it.

Hondas are solid choices, too - either manual or automatic gearboxes will stay together (aside from '00-'03ish automatics) but you need a manual to get anywhere quickly in most of 'em. Watch for rust on earlier cars, artificially inflated values on any of 'em, and don't be that guy who rices out his crapbox and annoys everyone on the block.

Oh, a Mazda would be a good bet as well. Maybe hunt down a '90s 626 with a five-speed and see how you like it. The Ford Contour/Mercury Mystique are in the same class and are decent as well, provided the one you're looking at is free of electrical gremlins. On those as well as the 626, you definitely want to avoid the failure-prone automatic, so if you decide you don't want to take on a stick shift yet, you may as well look elsewhere. The Protege is an enjoyable, and undervalued, econobox.

[x88x]

The Protege is an enjoyable, and undervalued, econobox.

Heheh, yup! I like mine. Nice and simple, surprisingly rugged, even if you...don't exactly care for it as well as you should for a while.. <_< >_> .. Light enough that you get good gas mileage (~40mpg when it's in good health, though atm with a wonky O2 sensor and an alignment issue with one of the wheels, it's more like 35-36 ), and just enough power that if you play the transmission right and rev the nuts off the engine, it's a god bit of fun. All in a rather boring-looking body, so cops don't look twice at it. There is definitely something to be said for a good, basic car...and mine is as basic as they made the Protege...even more so now that the A/C is blown. IIRC the 626 is basically the Protege with a bit more extra bits and a bigger engine. Same repair manual covers both.

Oh, something else I thought of. If you plan on doing any...shall we say, 'interesting' driving, try and get one with at least semi-bucket seats. Mine has nowhere near real bucket seats, but they're enough that they give me a nice amount of lateral support when such is needed. ...makes driving my dad's pickup with a bench seat bloody terrifying though...once you get used to not moving at all in a hard corner, it's hard to adjust to sliding half way across the seat if you're not careful.

EDIT:
Oh, and a lot of people will get freaked out if they're looking at a car with a manual transmission and no tach. Don't worry about it. The car I learned on had a tach, but the car I drove most for the first year or so after that, and my car too, both have manuals and neither has a tach. Personally, I've gotten so when I have one, I don't pay any attention to it any more; not having one forces you to develop a better feel for the vehicle.

[blaze15301]

I love the vw 2.0 ask me why...

i gotta ask why.

also x88x your car does look pretty cheap and it s a 4 cylinder so not a gas hog. what about upgradability?

[xr4man]

if you're talking about the protoge for upgradeability, you may have to hunker down and do a little research. i don't think it was a popular car to upgrade, so there my not e a huge aftermarket for it. but all that means is you have to research and find what items from other mazdas will fit it. or fit with little modification.

otherwise EVERYTHING is upgradeable. it all has to do with how much money you have.